# sust 250 tren E cycle question



## ghanabuff (Jun 22, 2008)

i'm about to start a cycle in 3 weeks.  the cycle will consist of 300 mg of  TREN E/ week along with 500mg of SUSTAMED 250/ WEEK.  I plan on running this cycle for 8 weeks maximum.  How does this cycle look compared to other cycles??? Should I add some D-BOL at 40 mg/day for 4 weeks??? I have used SUST before ,and I know it can sting like hell, I usually run it with EQ, which was milder and eased the sting associated with SUST... My question is will rhe TREN E being stacked with the SUST ease the sting like EQ did when I stacked it with SUST ???  I don't have access to EQ ....  I have also read recently that alot of people are using HCG as PCT I always thought that was a NO-NO and using HCG  as PCT will actually shut you down more.  what is the proper way and dosage to use HCG??? During or after a cycle???


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## rAJJIN (Jun 22, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> i'm about to start a cycle in 3 weeks.  the cycle will consist of 300 mg of  TREN E/ week along with 500mg of SUSTAMED 250/ WEEK.  I plan on running this cycle for 8 weeks maximum.  How does this cycle look compared to other cycles??? Should I add some D-BOL at 40 mg/day for 4 weeks??? I have used SUST before ,and I know it can sting like hell, I usually run it with EQ, which was milder and eased the sting associated with SUST... My question is will rhe TREN E being stacked with the SUST ease the sting like EQ did when I stacked it with SUST ???  I don't have access to EQ ....  I have also read recently that alot of people are using HCG as PCT I always thought that was a NO-NO and using HCG  as PCT will actually shut you down more.  what is the proper way and dosage to use HCG??? During or after a cycle???



GhanaBuff,
Test and Tren work real good together In my experiences. Maybe two of the best out there for the Money. I Myself probably wouldnt use Dbol and tren at the same time, I think the Sus and tren alone will give you some good quality muscle if your protein is high enough.
On the HCG I would use it during, Not after. goodluck bro


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## ghanabuff (Jun 22, 2008)

*how about this*

for maximum gains would AN 8 WEEEK CYCLE OF....400 MG OF DECA/WEEK AND 500 MG OF SUST/ WEEK ALONG WITH 40M/WEEK OF D-BOL FOR 4 WEEKS BE BETTER


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## Elvia1023 (Jun 22, 2008)

By the way when you say a max of 8 weeks do you mean 8 weeks worth of injections? That would be approx a 11 week cycle. I know the sust takes time to become effective but it is still in your system straightaway. I would do the 8 weeks of injections so you start PCT at week 11.

Should you use dbol? Well that entirely depends upon your exact goals for this cycle. As Raj says the test/tren combo will be good enough for anyone and will give you great gains. But if your goal is to just blow up and get really big then dbol for 4 weeks at the start would be ideal. So only you know if it is needed. But if you do maybe just do 30mg of dbol for the 4 weeks so you get better gains imo. Even 20mg would give you a nice start whilst the others are becoming effective.

With HCG it is very powerful. It will shut you down completely. It is mainly used to keep them from shrinking and aids recovery. Thats why I would rec taking it every 4-7 days. I would just do 500IU every 7 days just so it is not overpowering and does it's job. HCG can be good for PCT but not like most use it. They use it for half of their PCT. If you use it you have to ensure anti-estrogen use for 3 weeks after the HCG injection. Just do 500IU per week and do it upto the start of your PCT. Even doing it 1 week into your PCT will be good too. But none of this 2500IU every 4 days... just no need.

You should do a 4 week PCT imo. Especially if you do the HCG in week 1. Even 5 weeks is good. I done a 6 weeks PCT a few months back and it really done the job. But I don't mean high dose throughout. Something like-

Days 1-21= Clomid at 250mg day 1, days 2-11 at 100mg and days 12-21 at 50mg
Days 1-22= Nolvadex at 20mg per day
Days 23-28=Nolvadex at 10mg per day


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## ghanabuff (Jul 4, 2008)

*tren question*

My  Next Cycle Will Consist Of Tren E... I'm 6'2" 200lbs This Is My 3rd Cycle... 1st 2 Were Sust 250 At 500mg/week And Eq At 600 Mg/wk...i'm Gonna Try Tren E Now...what Would Be An Ideal Dosage?  I Was Thinking 300mg Per Week With 500 Mg Sust 250 For 8 Wks...and Is Tren E A Painful Injection Like Sust 250???? And Would Hcg Be Absolutely Neccessary With My Cycle???


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 4, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> My  Next Cycle Will Consist Of Tren E... I'm 6'2" 200lbs This Is My 3rd Cycle... 1st 2 Were Sust 250 At 500mg/week And Eq At 600 Mg/wk...i'm Gonna Try Tren E Now...what Would Be An Ideal Dosage?  I Was Thinking 300mg Per Week With 500 Mg Sust 250 For 8 Wks...and Is Tren E A Painful Injection Like Sust 250???? And Would Hcg Be Absolutely Neccessary With My Cycle???



Many would advise you to stay away from tren e until you have a few more cycles under your belt. I can't really advise as I done it in my first cycle! I would say a perfect dose would be 500mg sust and 300mg of tren e. 300mg is a nice amount but not too much so you will get great gains from that. If you was to up that I imagine you would experience more (and more severe) sides such as the cough often associated with the compound.

Painful injection... that depends upon brand and the individual. I used Eco Oil sachets and didn't feel a thing. On that logic I imagine the stealth line to be the similar (but you never though). What one person may find fine other thinks is painful. Saying that when I injected no one could find it painful cos I didn't feel a thing.

HCG is never completely needed but it is just great to have. It makes the other compounds work better, aids recovery and performance. If you didn't have it nothign major will happen aprt from shrinkage. They will go back over time (afew months). But I would defo advise to take HCG. So my suggestion for your cycle with the compounds you mention is-

Weeks 1-8= Sust 
Weeks 1-8= Tren E
Weeks 3-10= HCG at 500IU every 7 days

PCT to start on week 11

Weeks 1-3= Clomid at 200mg day 1, days 2-11 at 100mg and days 12-21 at 50mg
Weeks 1-3= Nolvadex at 20mg per day
Week 4= Nolvadex at 10mg per day

Then afterwards maybe try a good tribulus product for 1 month to give you that extra kick.

Incidentally you don't need dbol with the sust and tren e. Those 2 combined are good enough (test and tren are probably the 2 best compounds out there). But if you have to do dbol then just keep it at about 25mg just to give you that extra edge/size and strength. Hope it helps


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 4, 2008)

Some will say you shouldn't use tren e until atleast cycle 6 and I totally get that. But if you use it just keep the dose sensible. 300mg is fairly high for the compound but not too high. I forgot to mention you should have arimidex on hand for during your cycle.

By the way other good compound to look at instead of the tren e is masteron e. That is often desribed as a weak tren but many love it. I am trying it for most of my future cycles (in the next year). It also acts as a mild anti-estrogen which is unique. I would look at that and maybe think about tren for your following cycle or two. After I do my bulking cycles I will be doing test p and TREN A which is a winning combo. If you was to do sust with mast e I would do a kickstart of dbol for 4 weeks (maybe 30-40mg per day).


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## rAJJIN (Jul 5, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> for maximum gains would AN 8 WEEEK CYCLE OF....400 MG OF DECA/WEEK AND 500 MG OF SUST/ WEEK ALONG WITH 40M/WEEK OF D-BOL FOR 4 WEEKS BE BETTER




Thats tough to answer. My first thought is yes but the more I think its tough to say for sure. Trenbolone is some strong stuff. Ive used a shitload of tren Ace (*Tren enan doesnt have the same "Kick" Imo as the Ace*) over the years and Im certain its the strongest of everything you mentioned so far, Mg-per-Mg. I remember the old timers and books use to claim tren is 3 times the strength of test per Mg.

As a Beginner you cant go wrong with Test,Deca and some Dbol. Those compounds together are probably the most widley used and for a reason. There reasonably safe,Easy to use and get, And they work Damn good.
One or two shots a week and your done, other then popping a few Dbol tabs.

Now Back to your question. IMO if it was Test suspension and tren ACETATE
for 8 weeks it would blow away either of the two you listed. It would cost a lot more though, You would have to take shots EACH DAY, And Like elvia said Tren is realy Not Idea for a beginner to anabolics. Its some STRONG stuff.

So In short I like the second cycle you listed (The One above I quoted)
If you cant grow off that soemthing is wrong. Save the tren and test cycle for later down the road and get the good fast acting stuff.


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 5, 2008)

rAJJIN said:
			
		

> Thats tough to answer. My first thought is yes but the more I think its tough to say for sure. Trenbolone is some strong stuff. Ive used a shitload of tren Ace (*Tren enan doesnt have the same "Kick" Imo as the Ace*) over the years and Im certain its the strongest of everything you mentioned so far, Mg-per-Mg. I remember the old timers and books use to claim tren is 3 times the strength of test per Mg.
> 
> As a Beginner you cant go wrong with Test,Deca and some Dbol. Those compounds together are probably the most widley used and for a reason. There reasonably safe,Easy to use and get, And they work Damn good.
> One or two shots a week and your done, other then popping a few Dbol tabs.
> ...



Yeah the more I think about it you are best doing the test, deca and dbol. Imo the key ingredients are the test and dbol. Then you should pick from a list including deca, Eq, Mast, Primo... imo.

I made a mistake and meant tren for 8 weeks and not 10. Like Raj said it is strong stuff. It's androgenic/anabolic rating is 500 (5 times more than test). But as Raj says I would say it was more like 3 times stronger. I do have the opinion if your gonna get shutdown your gonna get shutdown.. but even thinking that I would still leave tren for future cycles. Deca is probably the most used compound (apart from test) and I found it good but I would pick from the others. That will shut you down 100% after 1 injection. I would pick the masteron e but it is expensive.

If you want to grow you done really need a big list of compounds. The test and dbol is more tahn enough. Just make sure your diet is just as good as your compounds.


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## ghanabuff (Jul 6, 2008)

*Cant Find Deca*

Alin Never Fails Me...but...i Can't Find Any Deca With Them, Alin Is The Only Source I Trust....so I'm Kind Of Apprehensive To Go With Anyone Else.  Thanks For The Advice Elvia And Raj...so No Tren E Huh...the Deca Sust And D-bol, Will Definitely Make Me Look Bloated Though...i Want More Of  A Defined Look


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## rAJJIN (Jul 6, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> Alin Never Fails Me...but...i Can't Find Any Deca With Them, Alin Is The Only Source I Trust....so I'm Kind Of Apprehensive To Go With Anyone Else.  Thanks For The Advice Elvia And Raj...so No Tren E Huh...the Deca Sust And D-bol, Will Definitely Make Me Look Bloated Though...i Want More Of  A Defined Look



Keep the sust, drop the deca and dbol. Replace with EQ and Var or winnV.
Diet is a Huge factor as well of course. Your right though the deca and dbol comes with some bloat.


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## rAJJIN (Jul 6, 2008)

Didnt mean to be so short there....
I should also add (maybe you already know) the winstrol is tough on the joints for most guys. The stuff works great But man after Just a few weeks on it
my Joints would pop and ache!

I Just seen you said youve ran the Eq before in the past.
Theres a lot of different ways and theorys out there bro. I Promise you there is No magic combination. I know guys On every level from beginner to pro`s
and they all use the same stuff.
When bulking" or Offseason"
Test,Deca,Dbol,Adrol,EQ,Tren,Hgh
Not all at once But normaly 2-3 different AAS MAX and the Hgh if they can afford it.

Cutting" or Precontest" Theres more to it if actualy preparing to do a show.
Dieuretics,Fat burners,T3,T4, DNP, EPO Etc etc Most guys will hire someone to do that part for them. Its way Over my head even for the most part But you guys have BigA from here that knows all this stuff!!
Again though the steroid part is easy and no secret or secret combo-
Faster acting gear and a Lot of the same stuff as when bulking.
Test (usualy suspension or prop) EQ,Winstrol,anavar,Anadrol,Masteron,Tren,Halotestin ,HGH

The steroid Part is easy fellas. The real battle is being truthfull to yourself about the Nutrition and protein intake. As well as training Your ass off But also Not overtraining.


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## ghanabuff (Jul 6, 2008)

*I'm Running An 8 Week Cycle*

I Want To Stick To An 8 Week Cycle...so Eq Is Out, 8 Weeks Won't Be Enough For It To Actually Have A Real Affect...so What Would Be The Best Combo For An 8 Week Cycle, For Bulking?? I Want To Put On 8-12 Lbs Of Quality Muscle, Without The Bloat...will Masteron Add Bulk ??  Maybe Masteron Along With D-bol, And Sust 250???


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 7, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> I Want To Stick To An 8 Week Cycle...so Eq Is Out, 8 Weeks Won't Be Enough For It To Actually Have A Real Affect...so What Would Be The Best Combo For An 8 Week Cycle, For Bulking?? I Want To Put On 8-12 Lbs Of Quality Muscle, Without The Bloat...will Masteron Add Bulk ??  Maybe Masteron Along With D-bol, And Sust 250???



So you want to bulk but you say without the bloat. I imagine you are picking dbol due to it's fast effects. But as Raj states that is no good for what you want. You can also pick adex for protection but there is no point as dbol is simply used to go huge/big. If you want to remain toned there is no point having it. Deca isn't so bad but does bloat you so stay clear from that. Sust would be my choice. I would pick from the following list to foprm my cycle-

Sust
Test P
Test S
Anavar
Primo
Masteron
Masteron E
Tbol 
Eq

By the way winny is suppose to be great and you can get joint support for that but the list above is more that enough to pick from. My suggestion for your cycle would be-

Sust
Tbol or Avar
You could add Mast E to that or Eq/Primo but they wouldn't be needed.

Just realized you said 8 weeks. So do you mean 8 weeks total time? Or 8 weeks of injection? Because if you just want to be on for 8 weeks imo you would have to take short esters. I would do either

Test P
Mast 
Tbol or Avar

OR

Test P
Tbol or Anavar

Just realized you still wanna bulk a fair amount so I would defo do turinabol (tbol). So imo your cycle should be 

- Short Estered Test
- Tbol

And if you want to pick a 3rd compound do so from the following
- Masteron P or E
- Eq
- Primo
- Winny

I know I have listed many things but just wanna give you correct info. I do think 8 weeks is too short for Sust. You would have to stop injecting on week 5 and it takes many weeks to fully kick in so your not feeling the great effects all that long. I am doing a shorter cycle with Sust but I am doing 8 weeks of injections (11 week cycle). I think 11 is the shortest someone should be on sust - but everyone has a different opinion.

Tbol really is what you should be looking at for what you want. Combine that with a test. You could even get test E that carries some water but if you use a decent amount of adex and keep your diet tight you should be fine.

Just wanna emphasize what Raj said. Just how important diet is. Pro BB use all the stuff me and you do. The reason they are like that is because they put in 100% educated effort in DIET and TRAINING. Anyone can inject themselves and swallow some dbol and get big but very few can get and maintain a big, toned and healthy body. If you take a test with tbol/avar and have a great (relevant) diet to your goals you will only achieve them. Goodluck with your cycle and let us know what you pick and how it goes.


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 7, 2008)

I wrote 'just realized...' a few times above. I am abit slow today. I start some tbol soon so went out on the w/e before I do. I ended up pulling some stripper and went back with her and didn't have any sleep. Then I stayed in town and just went to my mates event (club event) in the same clothes on at 3-8pm and out again after that. Had no sleep all w/e but had some last night but still feel wrecked. Not good just having 1 sandwich and an apple over a day and a half... well we can have one bad day I guess!


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## rAJJIN (Jul 7, 2008)

8 week cycle in my mind is 8 weeks of Injections.
I get what your saying 100% Elvia but Ive never heard someone explain it like that.


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 8, 2008)

rAJJIN said:
			
		

> 8 week cycle in my mind is 8 weeks of Injections.
> I get what your saying 100% Elvia but Ive never heard someone explain it like that.



Not the best explanation... I can be excused abit of a heavy w/e! I just meant if you are only doing it for 8 weeks then you should pick short-estered compounds. For ghanabuff I think Test P would be the best. A great combo is test p and mast p as they are the same ester and compliment eachother very well. I know they are mainly used for cutting cycles but with the addition of an oral (or even without) I think they will work extremely well for a lean muscle gain cycle (I know cutting cycles can be the same as lean muscle gain). Test E would also be good and you stop injecting at week 6 (or do extra weeks cos 8 is very short). With that logic you could still use sust but I just think that is better for longer cycles. 

I am gonna do an oral in about 90% of my future cycles. And for his aims I would add tbol at 6 weeks at 40mg. The 3 combined should defo give you 7-15 pounds in the 8 weeks. With effective PCT (and diet) you should keep a solid 7-12 pounds. Although everyone reacts differently... you may gain more or less.

By the way imo I would say recovery is pretty much the same for 8 and 10 week cycles. I know the longer obviously the harder recovery. But it is mainly when you reach 12+ that recovery starts getting effected significantly. If I wanted to do a shorter cycle with your aims I would do 8 weeks of injections of test e and mast e (10 week cycle). I would kickstart with 6 weeks of tbol. I am doing a similar cycle soon but doing dbol instead (I want to get big). But thats just what I would do.


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 8, 2008)

rAJJIN said:
			
		

> 8 week cycle in my mind is 8 weeks of Injections.
> I get what your saying 100% Elvia but Ive never heard someone explain it like that.



I get what your saying too and I would always think an 8 week cycle is 8 weeks of injections. So depending upon ester that could be a total of just over 8 or 11. But I think Ghanabuff actually means an 8 week cycle as in your system for 8 weeks (I am probably wrong). Thats why I asked cos if so short esters would be best. If it is 8 weeks of injections then sust ot test e would be good with the likes of mast e etc. Let us know if you can.


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## ghanabuff (Jul 8, 2008)

*eight weeks of injection*

i meant 8 weeks of injections...sust 250 500mg/wk and possibly tren e ...i know u guys advise me against it but i think i'm ready...why do u think tren would be bad for me at this point?   just curious...if not tren ...maybe i would consider d-bol and sust 250...the sust should not be as bad in terms of water retention...


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 8, 2008)

ghanabuff said:
			
		

> i meant 8 weeks of injections...sust 250 500mg/wk and possibly tren e ...i know u guys advise me against it but i think i'm ready...why do u think tren would be bad for me at this point?   just curious...if not tren ...maybe i would consider d-bol and sust 250...the sust should not be as bad in terms of water retention...



Thats cool then. 8 weeks of injections is 11 weeks and imo a perfect amount of time for a cycle. Not too short and not too long so recovery will be aided. To be honest from personal experience I can't say tren e would be a massive mistake. I done it in my first cycle (totally unaware) but was fine. I looked at the countless descriptions online but never belonged to a forum so never saw the countless threads warning against using it for beginners. So I will go on the numerous threads saying to stay well away from it for beginners. Even though I was fine I have never seen anyone else write on a forum saying it is good for new users (everyone says stay away). So from my personal experience I can say it might be fine but people on here have much more experience so I would simply just wait. So just cos I was ok I imagine most wouldn't. There are so many compounds out there so I think there is no need to try it just yet. I don't want you to try it and because of it's strength you find it hard recovering properly.

In regards to your cycle your logic is all wrong. I just mean the ay you think  sust is good for water weight so that with dbol will be fine. Just cos Sust is good the dbol will give you more than enough water alone. You said you want to gain some lean muscle without any bloat... which I totally understand as it is over the summer too. Sust alone is likely to give you that but I would personally try turinabol. It is decribed as dbol without the water weight and I hear countless people say how good it is for strength and lean muscle gain. That coupled with Sust will give you all you need. I haven't used tbol yet so can't speak from personal experience. But I have just had my first 20mg about an hour ago. I will have other 20mg just b4 the gym later. So I will know in a few weeks. I am only doing it alone (that could star a whole other thread). It's just a mini cycle b4 my main one of Sust, Mast and Dbol (I want to bloat alittle). 

So those 2 are all you need. Just keep it simple. I wouldn't use the tren e and for you if you want to use a 3rd compound try the mast e. The only problem is I don't think Alin has tbol at the moment. I am sure he will any day though - best asking him. If you only want to use him (which I understand) then if your not prepared to wait I would pick Anavar for the strength and great feeling to go with the sust and maybe mast. They will give you your lean muscle gains and cut you up. So an ideal cycle for you imo would be-

Weeks 1-8= Sust at 500mg
Weeks 1-6= Tbol at 40mg per day

OR

Weeks 1-8= Sust at 500mg
Weeks 1-8= Mast E at 400mg per week
Weeks 1-6= Tbol at 40mg per day

That way you have about 6 weeks of tbol, 10 weeks of Mast and 11 weeks of Sust (11 week cycle). Imo a perfect balance for any cycle. Plus you wouldn't have to take protection during which can slow gains. Maybe alittle with the 2 compound cycle but the masteron acts as a weak anti-estrogen so you wouldn't need to take any protection (adex, arom, pro etc) due to the sust dose not being huge and the tbol not converting much.

Hope it helps


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## Elvia1023 (Jul 8, 2008)

If you want some good info on tbol just go to the Anabolic Steroid Articles section on this site. On the first page is a thread called turanabol. Just check that out (good read).


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