# ~Transgender Crossfit Competitor~ Poll...



## WesleyInman (Mar 7, 2014)

*~TransGender Crossfit Competitor~ Poll...*
Do you think this Transgender man who changed into a woman should be allowed to compete in Crossfit games should be allowed to compete as a woman??

*Is it fair? Should it be legal?

Thoughts??*

*LINK*
http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/07/us/tra...suit-crossfit/ TO ARTICLE


(CNN) -- A transgender woman prohibited from competing in a strength competition as a female is suing the fitness company sponsoring the competition, seeking $2.5 million in damages.
Chloie Jonnson, a personal trainer, charges the CrossFit company with discrimination, intentional infliction of emotional distress and unfair competition in a lawsuit filed Thursday in Santa Cruz, California.


While her lawyer calls it a case of discrimination against transgender people, CrossFit's lawyer calls it protecting the competition.
Last year, Jonnson sought to compete in the CrossFit Games, a contest aimed at determining the fittest man and woman.


According to the lawsuit, Jonnson has identified herself as a female since her teenage years and is legally recognized by California as a woman. She had sexual reassignment surgery in 2006 and has been on female hormone therapy, according to her lawsuit.
The lawsuit alleges that a CrossFit teammate of Jonnson's sent an anonymous e-mail to the games organizers asking about transgender athletes in the competition. CrossFit determined that competitors in the event had to compete in the gender of their birth.
Jonnson disagreed with its decision and the dispute has escalated to a lawsuit.


"The fundamental, ineluctable fact is that a male competitor who has a sex reassignment procedure still has a genetic makeup that confers a physical and physiological advantage over women," according to theletter from CrossFit's lawyer sent in October.
CNN reached out to CrossFit but did not get a response on Thursday. The letter from CrossFit was provided to CNN by Jonnson's attorney, Waukeen McCoy, who blasted the company's decision.


"(Jonnson) doesn't have an advantage over other women. She's been on estrogen for such a long time," he said about his client.
Hormone replacement therapy for transgender women includes anti-androgen therapy, which nullifies the effects of testosterone to reduce the masculine features of the body. Therapies can also consist of the hormones, estrogen and progesterone to feminize the body.
Transgender men receive the opposite types of hormones -- mainly testosterone to masculinze their bodies with features such as increased muscle and hair growth.


McCoy said that CrossFit should change its rules to be more like the International Olympic Committee, which allows transgender athletes to compete in their identified gender after undergoing sexual reassignment surgery.


"She's female," McCoy said about Jonnson. "She's legally female. A corporation like CrossFit, they're doing business in California. The law precludes from discrimination on gender identity."
He said Jonnson seeks a reversal in the competition's policy.


The lawsuit also alleges that CrossFit's policy of having to compete in a person's original birth gender, would require that transgender athletes would have to reveal their personal histories. In essence, that they'd have to "out" themselves, even if they sought privacy, the lawsuit alleges.
After her sexual reassignment surgery, Jonnson changed all her records to reflect her sex change to female, including her birth certificate, according to her lawsuit. Jonnson kept her background a secret and did not identify herself as transgender, according to the complaint.
In a press release statement, Jonnson said: "If I am going to be forced to out myself, I want it to be for the good for all transgendered people and athletes -- not because of a company's discriminatory policies."


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## AnaSCI (Mar 7, 2014)

At first thought I would say no, people should only be able to compete in the gender of their birth.

That being said, I think that there should be some studies done and if it is proven that these therapies do in fact change the body into the desired gender and not just appearance wise, then possibly it would not be an issue as there is no physical advantage.


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## dorian777 (Mar 7, 2014)

You are either born a man or a woman. This transgender stuff is complete garbage. There will be lawsuit after lawsuit over this and similar issues which is a lawyer's dream come true.


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## xmen1234 (Mar 7, 2014)

Birth Certificates should be required for competitions.


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## AtomAnt (Mar 7, 2014)

Anasci makes a great point.... how do we know for sure the he/she would have a physical advantage?  That being said, if I had to make the decision today, it would be no.


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## psych (Mar 7, 2014)

I bet they just make a different category for the competitor.  He/she/it would be alone unless another transgender shows up.  

What if you had a transgender female to male-person. She takes test, she competes against women????  She would have to go against men.


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## Phoe2006 (Mar 7, 2014)

Before we get into another big discussion about "evolution" again or god I think personally if you're born a man u should be made to compete against man regardless if u cut it off same with a woman. This is the way your born and u should be made to provide a birth certificate at each competition to prove it but again this is just MHO


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## dorian777 (Mar 7, 2014)

Phoe2006 said:


> Before we get into another big discussion about "evolution" again or god I think personally if you're born a man u should be made to compete against man regardless if u cut it off same with a woman. This is the way your born and u should be made to provide a birth certificate at each competition to prove it but again this is just MHO



And if you try to compete as a he-she you should be ridiculed for being a complete weirdo, not glorified as a hero by the media.


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## psych (Mar 7, 2014)

Phoe2006 said:


> Before we get into another big discussion about "evolution" again or god I think personally if you're born a man u should be made to compete against man regardless if u cut it off same with a woman. This is the way your born and u should be made to provide a birth certificate at each competition to prove it but again this is just MHO



Where did we get into evolution or God?

I would hope we wouldn't go into those debates cause this play will turn into Tnation really fast......


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## Phoe2006 (Mar 7, 2014)

I was referring to the big long ass thread they were debating about a few months ago about evolution and god just being a smart ass


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## psych (Mar 7, 2014)

Phoe2006 said:


> I was referring to the big long ass thread they were debating about a few months ago about evolution and god just being a smart ass



I know bro. 

When I saw that thread start I just walked away...

But if this thread picks up later, *in a way that isn't about the core subject*, I think it should be moved to off-topic.


WeslyInnman this is a great post and thank you for sharing the info bro!


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## Nattydread (Mar 8, 2014)

Would hormone therapy they go thru change their bone structure to be women like?


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## hawkeyes56 (Mar 8, 2014)

If she has already had the surgery then she has been on a hormone(estrogen) regimen for several years.  Also she is obviously not going to be producing testosterone any longer after the surgery and one would assume that if she had the surgery then she has been dealing with the feeling that she was a woman her whole life so I think it would be safe to figure that she wasn't weight training or doing anything to make herself appear overly masculine at any time, therefore it would stand to reason that she doesn't have any significant advantage at this point over her(born) female counterparts.


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## dorian777 (Mar 8, 2014)

hawkeyes56 said:


> If she has already had the surgery then she has been on a hormone(estrogen) regimen for several years.  Also she is obviously not going to be producing testosterone any longer after the surgery and one would assume that if she had the surgery then she has been dealing with the feeling that she was a woman her whole life so I think it would be safe to figure that she wasn't weight training or doing anything to make herself appear overly masculine at any time, therefore it would stand to reason that she doesn't have any significant advantage at this point over her(born) female counterparts.



Except it is mentally ill.


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## hawkeyes56 (Mar 8, 2014)

Well as I am neither an MD nor a psychologist I cannot argue whether it is or is not a mental illness.  However I am open minded enough to understand that perhaps it is just a birth defect, maybe the egg split it a way that wasn't intended.  I know it isn't for me to decide how someone lives their life or what they do with their body.  I would think anyone on this board, that uses any sort of illegal substance to enhance their body would have to admit they were the ultimate hypocrite if they did so.   I mean if you really want to take it down the path of someone should be happy with the way they are and not change it in any way medically or chemically, just food for thought.  I do not have a dog in this fight but I would expect the people who frequent this board to be a little more open minded than to just right off someone as mentally ill because they want to change their body.


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## dorian777 (Mar 8, 2014)

hawkeyes56 said:


> Well as I am neither an MD nor a psychologist I cannot argue whether it is or is not a mental illness.  However I am open minded enough to understand that perhaps it is just a birth defect, maybe the egg split it a way that wasn't intended.  I know it isn't for me to decide how someone lives their life or what they do with their body.  I would think anyone on this board, that uses any sort of illegal substance to enhance their body would have to admit they were the ultimate hypocrite if they did so.   I mean if you really want to take it down the path of someone should be happy with the way they are and not change it in any way medically or chemically, just food for thought.  I do not have a dog in this fight but I would expect the people who frequent this board to be a little more open minded than to just right off someone as mentally ill because they want to change their body.



Maybe I'm older than you and this is why I feel this way. I've seen this crap coming for years. I haven't been influenced by the politically correct crowd and I use common sense to guide me. Now, there's a big difference in injecting some tren to make me even more of a man than I already am, and chopping off my dick to become a woman. Now if someone wants to do that, yeah it's a free country, go right ahead. But when you want to enter a contest, beauty pageant, etc. that's when things can get totally ridiculous. Then these people sue people like me, who don't agree with their perverted ideas. You have to see the big picture here. They don't just want "rights." They want your blessing as well.


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## Sully (Mar 8, 2014)

For those that failed to read and comprehend the story above, providing a birth certificate accomplishes nothing, because birth certificates CAN BE CHANGED! This woman had hers changed to reflect her current sex after her reassignment surgery, as many transgendered people do. All paperwork, including birth certificates, college and high school transcripts, drivers licenses, and a lifetime of medical records can be updated to reflect a persons current sex. There can quite literally be no paper trail left that would identify a transgendered person as ever having been of another sex at any point in their lives. 

Reading comprehension, it's not just for 5th graders.


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## dorian777 (Mar 8, 2014)

Lil' Sully said:


> For those that failed to read and comprehend the story above, providing a birth certificate accomplishes nothing, because birth certificates CAN BE CHANGED! This woman had hers changed to reflect her current sex after her reassignment surgery, as many transgendered people do. All paperwork, including birth certificates, college and high school transcripts, drivers licenses, and a lifetime of medical records can be updated to reflect a persons current sex. There can quite literally be no paper trail left that would identify a transgendered person as ever having been of another sex at any point in their lives.
> 
> Reading comprehension, it's not just for 5th graders.



So Iris Kyle could in fact really be a man?


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## d2r2ddd (Mar 8, 2014)

If Hussain Bolt become transgender , can he compete in the women 100m sprint??


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## Big-John (Mar 8, 2014)

dorian777 said:


> Maybe I'm older than you and this is why I feel this way. I've seen this crap coming for years. I haven't been influenced by the politically correct crowd and I use common sense to guide me. Now, there's a big difference in injecting some tren to make me even more of a man than I already am, and chopping off my dick to become a woman. Now if someone wants to do that, yeah it's a free country, go right ahead. But when you want to enter a contest, beauty pageant, etc. that's when things can get totally ridiculous. Then these people sue people like me, who don't agree with their perverted ideas. You have to see the big picture here. They don't just want "rights." They want your blessing as well.



I couldn't have said it better myself.


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## hawkeyes56 (Mar 8, 2014)

I do not disagree with your opinion on the lawsuit side of things, and as far as joining the politically correct crowd I am sure you and I would agree on far more things than we disagree about.  I know a couple of transgender people though and maybe that is why I am more open to what their thoughts and feelings are, they literally feel as if they were born into the wrong body and struggle with feelings every day that I could not nor would I ever want to try and comprehend.  I do not see there being a big difference though, obviously the surgery is different but they take hormones that are naturally occuring in their bodies, albeit on a very limited basis, taking tren, which is not naturally occurring in your body, or using synthol to change body size and shape are pretty close to the same things.  They have breast augmentation some top pros have been accused of having calf implants.  Anyway we aren't going to change the world or even each other's views on this but a good debate is always fun especially because this one didn't devolve into name calling or bashing each other and I appreciate that.  By the way if you ever want to read a good book, Warrior Princess: A U.S. Navy SEAL's Journey to Coming out Transgender.


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## Sully (Mar 8, 2014)

dorian777 said:


> So Iris Kyle could in fact really be a man?



I don't know whom that is, nor am I sure what point you're trying to make with that question.


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## BigBob (Mar 8, 2014)

The fact that this is even a serious discussion is disturbing.


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## dorian777 (Mar 8, 2014)

Lil' Sully said:


> I don't know whom that is, not am I sure what point you're trying to make with that question.




9 time Ms. Olympia


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## Sully (Mar 8, 2014)

dorian777 said:


> 9 time Ms. Olympia



Ok. Nice to know, I guess. But once again, were you trying to make a point by asking that question, or were you just doing some random non-sensical wondering in the forum?


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## Sully (Mar 8, 2014)

BigBob said:


> The fact that this is even a serious discussion is disturbing.



I find it highly disturbing, too. But, likely for the exact opposite reason you do.


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## Ironbuilt (Mar 9, 2014)

If a transgender female to male can beat a male he should retire cause then ure the pussy. Whoever has a ureterous is a women ..carrot or no carrot. Guys cannot compete as women unless hes hermaphrodite which is penisgina.  Hmm new term..


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## dorian777 (Mar 9, 2014)

The next Ms. Universe. Remember to keep an open-mind!


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## Ironbuilt (Mar 9, 2014)

:naughty1:Rofglol....


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## Slate23 (Mar 9, 2014)

As far as the science goes, Anasci is right in that the woman wouldn't have any advantages over the other women. And who cares what this person does with her own body? If it makes her feel better and she isn't hurting anyone else then I'm happy for her.


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## fubaseball (Mar 9, 2014)

I don't think she should be able to compete as a woman... But she is not strong enough to beat those women anyway, so why not...


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## dorian777 (Mar 10, 2014)

Here's a pic of "her." Hey IB, would ya?


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## Phoe2006 (Mar 10, 2014)

Ofcourse he would is that a silly question


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## Slate23 (Mar 10, 2014)

Who looks more like a woman? Her or Iris kyle?


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## dorian777 (Mar 10, 2014)

Well, Chloie was a man who wanted to be a woman and Iris was a woman who wanted to be a man. Both got their wish...sort of...through the power of hormones. Now Slate, we haven't seen all of the evidence...you know...down there...to make a clear decision yet on the matter.


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## Sully (Mar 10, 2014)

Slate23 said:


> Who looks more like a woman? Her or Iris kyle?


 If I had to choose between the two, I'm taking the trans crossfit chick.


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## Slate23 (Mar 10, 2014)

You think that women that get to that level in bodybuilding really want to be men?


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## dorian777 (Mar 10, 2014)

Slate23 said:


> You think that women that get to that level in bodybuilding really want to be men?



The hormones do the work whether they want it or not.


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## dorian777 (Mar 10, 2014)

Lil' Sully said:


> If I had to choose between the two, I'm taking the trans crossfit chick.



Are you sure about that? Here's another pic. Maybe a butter-face, Sully?


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## Ironbuilt (Mar 10, 2014)

Is it ok he does the sports illustrated swim edition  suit too?


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## d2r2ddd (Mar 10, 2014)

IB, dats really a gross pic... Makes me lose appetite !!


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## Sully (Mar 10, 2014)

dorian777 said:


> Are you sure about that? Here's another pic. Maybe a butter-face, Sully?



I didn't say she's hot, or even attractive. I said if I HAD to choose between the two of them. At least the trans chick bears a resemblance to the feminine form.


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## Phoe2006 (Mar 10, 2014)

That's just funny ib good one


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## chrisr116 (Apr 3, 2014)

Ib, you must have lots of spare time on your hands. Haha


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## Phoe2006 (Apr 3, 2014)

chrisr116 said:


> Ib, you must have lots of spare time on your hands. Haha



God I just looked at that pic ib posted and fuckin almost fell off the couch laughing my dogs laying in my lap and anytime I move she gets pissed off. Needless to say she looked up when I was laughing and appeared to have a face of utter disgust


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