# Blasting Niacin for Cholesterol Recovery



## amateurmale

Read a study (let me try and find the link) where an individual ran 4,000mgs flushing niacin a day.  He had an increase in hdl of 135%, a decrease in ldl of about 30-40% and a noticeable drop in triglycerides. 


I think I am going to try this protocol and report my results. Current hdl is mid 20's and ldl is mid 120's. Triglycerides are always low thanks to genetics. 

Of course niacin at this dosage can be hard on the liver so I'm goin to be running liv52. Actually I run liv52 nearly year round anyways. 


Anybod have anything they want to add?


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## dudcki27

I hear crickets.


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## Maxwkw

Sounds uncomfortable


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## amateurmale

Maxwkw said:


> Sounds uncomfortable



:wtf:????????????


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## LuKiFeR

amateurmale said:


> :wtf:????????????



uuuh.....



HOW BOUT DEM COWBOYS!!!!


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## dudcki27

Maxwkw said:


> Sounds uncomfortable



WTH?


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## Ironbuilt

Sounds like a real red skin event..lol    i  should do it too but im on a good run of real deal shit..lol. will it still work ?.


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## amateurmale

Ironbuilt said:


> Sounds like a real red skin event..lol    i  should do it too but im on a good run of real deal shit..lol. will it still work ?.




What is real deal shit first of all?   

The supplements needed to have the "best" cholesterol readings on cycle go as follows. 10mgs/day of nolva, 1000-1500mgs/day of niacin and use exemestane only as ur AI. Also run a liver protectant like liv52 since u will b running gear and niacin thru ur system.  

Well....I couldve sworn there way something else I was going to add but my brain doesn't seem to b working at full capacity yet.

Oh and as far as red skin,your body gets used to it fast. Last night I took 4,000mgs. I was red and itched for 5-10 minutes. I hardly noticed it. Make sure u don't jump to a heavy dose right off the bat. U might throw up. Start with 500mgs and go up eod from there.


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## Maxwkw

Any time I take any significant amount of niacin I'm red for hours.


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## vikingquest

You take it all at once or split doses am/pm?


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## Maxwkw

All at once. 

I will try splitting it


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## Enigmatic707

Niacin is like poison to me- I have pretty bad reactions to it on moderate doses.


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## amateurmale

Take 1000mgs four times a day.


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## Ironbuilt

Lmao. Realdealshit=gear that works as said


Ok so plain jane niacin no slo niacin


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## amateurmale

Ironbuilt said:


> Lmao. Realdealshit=gear that works as said
> 
> 
> Ok so plain jane niacin no slo niacin




Just regular ole niacin. I get mine from Discount Vitamins & Herbal Supplements from Puritan's Pride.  I started yesterday. Ill run it a month and report back here with bloods.


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## BIG D

curious to hear these results.  i have niacin on hand, but every time i start to use it, i quit bc of the gawd awful feeling i get from it! also have nolva on hand, so if my upcoming labs still show my hdl/ldl are still off then nova it is...MAYBE niacin too, doubtful tho


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## amateurmale

3rd day on 4000mgs a day and I no longer get itchy or red.  I added a baby aspirin too since that helps to suppress the flushing and itching.


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## Jhezel

Naicin does wonders on my lipid profile.


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## amateurmale

Jhezel said:


> Naicin does wonders on my lipid profile.



got my triglycerides down to 30 and ldl down to 80 last time


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## amateurmale

over a week in and im getting no redness and maybe 2-3 minute of itching if any

im still at 4000mgs, some days i go as high as 4500.


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## BIG D

You gonna get bloods soon to see how this worked?


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## amateurmale

Yes


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## Ironbuilt

Go big or go home.!   Flushing always stops after a few days .isnt niacin also good for reducing acne.. what else it good for ..?


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## amateurmale

Antioxidant effect
Blood sugar control
Decrease of cholesterol levels
Detoxification
Production of adrenal hormones
Production of hydrochloric acid in the stomach
Production of sex hormones
Vitamin B3 will also turn fat into energy, as it is also involved in fat metabolism.


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## BIG D

cool keep us posted


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## amateurmale

I'm up to 5000-6000mgs a day.   Absolutely no flushing or itching and still taking liv 52 DS twice a day. 

Trt is at 125mgs test cyp and 50mgs mast enan.

Everything seems to be going fine.  I'm 16 days in so I'm getting bloods after 14 more days.


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## gabe walker

would have replied sooner, but had some problems with my acct here at anasci. 

recent clinical research has shown that the increased HDL -C from Niacin is non functional and has no protective benefit from adverse cardiac events...
http://www.uphs.upenn.edu/news/News_Releases/2013/03/rader/
New Research Shows that While Niacin Added to Statin Therapy Increases HDL Cholesterol Levels It Does Not Improve HDL Functionality

Pterostilbene ( a potent ppar alpha agonist)however does significantly improve your lipid profile in a equal molar, dose dependent manner to ciprofibrate, fenofibrate without dose adjustments for abnormal liver values common to fibrate therapy...
http://www.hindawi.com/journals/jt/2013/463595/
Analysis of Safety from a Human Clinical Trial with Pterostilbene

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf0580364
Pterostilbene, a New Agonist for the Peroxisome Proliferator-Activated Receptor α-Isoform, Lowers Plasma Lipoproteins and Cholesterol in Hypercholesterolemic Hamsters

FYI: fenofibrate has a novel action in that it also decreases myostatin expression..
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/21304067/?i=2&from=fenofibrate myostatin
Fenofibrate, a PPAR{alpha} agonist, decreases atrogenes and myostatin expression and improves arthritis-induced skeletal muscle atrophy.


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## amateurmale

Niacin also lowers ldl and triglycerides. 

And I'm not sure I'm buyin the recent research you posted since there's tons of studies showing the opposite with niacin.


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## Ironbuilt

True AM ..new study.new drug..can we say "pimpin'..
I dont believe new studies either.. look at phen phen..lol.


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## gabe walker

amateurmale said:


> Niacin also lowers ldl and triglycerides.
> 
> And I'm not sure I'm buyin the recent research you posted since there's tons of studies showing the opposite with niacin.



Sure thing I see your point, however that link was to three very recent studies that came to the same conclusion, that the HDL-C from supraphysiological dosages of Niacin is ineffective at preventing an adverse cardiac event in the future. 

While it does effectively raise HDL-C levels that may not be beneficial and maybe detrimental in the long run...

The AIM HIGH study was terminated for the same reason, "niacin/niaspan did not demonstrate a beneficial effect on the primary endpoint."
AIM-HIGH Study Overview

of those pt's that had an ischemic stroke all were taking niacin either alone or combination with a statin and all had their event up to 4 years after discontinuing niacin therapy.

Despite increasing HDL-C niacin is very pro inflammatory...

Nacin also *increases* homocystine levels dramatically while driving down levels of B6 and B12, in addition to* significantly increasing* endothelial inflammatory marker Lp-PLA2 "the reason for the failure of the AIM-HIGH failure"
Niacin (nicotinic acid) in non-physiological doses... [Br J Nutr. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI
Niacin (nicotinic acid) in non-physiological doses causes hyperhomocysteineaemia in Sprague-Dawley rats.

Abstract 16318: Niacin Dramatically Raises the Endothelial Inflammatory Marker Lp-PLA2: The Reason the AIM-HIGH Trail Failed Despite Improvements in HDL and Triglycerides -- Gundry and Epstein 124 (10021): A16318 -- Circulation
 Niacin Dramatically Raises the Endothelial Inflammatory Marker Lp-PLA2: The Reason the AIM-HIGH Trail Failed Despite Improvements in HDL and Triglycerides

Of course all this is even a concern if you believe the flawed mythology that dyslipidemia the "lipid hypothesis" cause heart disease in the first place, and yes you will find hundreds of studies supporting "high LDL, low HDL = increased risk of adverse cardiac event", that does not prove causation though... 

Cholesterol doesn’t cause heart disease
Highlights recent findings..

Report of the Conference on Low Blood Cholestero... [Circulation. 1992] - PubMed - NCBI
Report of the Conference on Low Blood Cholesterol: Mortality Associations. 
"Reviewed 11 major studies including 125,000 women, it was determined that there was absolutely no relationship between total cholesterol levels and mortality from cardiovascular or any other causes."

See also the Framingham Heart Study and MONICA studies
Framingham Heart Study

All current and relevant research is now directed at inflammation and oxidative stress as the precipitating factors of cardiac disease not cholesterol either dietary or serum (of which there is no correlation between those two as well). High LDL, low HDL serve more as warning signs that something is potentially wrong..

And an added benefit of elevated LDL-C from a recent Texas A&M study:
*Texas A&M study on Cholesterol in conjunction with the University of Pittsburgh, Kent State University, the Johns Hopkins Weight Management Center and the Northern Ontario School of Medicine *Bad Cholesterol Not as Bad as People Think, Study Shows | College of Education and Human Development

"Of 52 adults from ages to 60 to 69 who were in generally good health but not physically active, and none of them were participating in a training program. The study showed that after fairly vigorous workouts, *participants who had gained the most muscle mass also had the highest levels of LDL *(bad) cholesterol, "a very unexpected result and one that surprised us."

"The more LDL you have in your blood, the better you are able to build muscle during resistance training."

American College of Cardiology 
ww.cardiosource.org/News-Media/Media-Center/News-Releases/2012/03/LDL_Cancer.aspx
LOW LDL CHOLESTEROL IS RELATED TO CANCER RISK

Pterostilbene is not a "new" drug it is a stilbenoid like resveratrol, but significantly more bioavailable, nor are the fibrate class drugs new....

Besides, why would you not want to utilize a ppar alpha agonist and derive all of its other benefits as well in addition to normalizing lipids/triglycerides, but also anti cancer, neuro protective, increased lipolysis and fatty acid metabolism, oxidation, and increased insulin sensitivity, as well as anti inflammatory through NF-kB inhibition and its role in skeletal myogenesis hypertrophy/atrophy through inhibition of UPS system and  atrogen1/MAFbx, MuRF1 i.e. atrophy/catabolism.  

File:Human hepatocyte PPARalpha transcriptome.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## amateurmale

Wtf?   Ok. Please post this info elsewhere I don't want to argue about niacin I just want to log and post my bloodwork results after blasting it. Thanks!

No hijack!


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## gabe walker

Hey, not trying to hijack, just provided some additional info to consider and possible alternatives to meet your needs... I've used niacin in the past myself... What do they say "knowledge is......"


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## amateurmale

:sSig_cool2::sSig_thankyou:


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## amateurmale

OK, I just ordered the top 10 most important test for a male from direct labs.  Lets see what all this niacin has done after a month.  Ill post results as soon as I get them.


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## joh9356

Cant knock Niacin either, can only post results. Major redskin here too. Hadn't heard of any side-effects before taking it, and was taking 1000mg per day.....had the reaction a few days later and was like wtf......

Read up on it, and figured out that it was Niacin flush. Went off of it, and was fine. That's just my experience....


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## amateurmale

joh9356 said:


> Cant knock Niacin either, can only post results. Major redskin here too. Hadn't heard of any side-effects before taking it, and was taking 1000mg per day.....had the reaction a few days later and was like wtf......
> 
> Read up on it, and figured out that it was Niacin flush. Went off of it, and was fine. That's just my experience....



Cool. That doesn't really have anything to do with cholesterol recovery but hey the more needless posts the better. 

Fyi, next time u try something u should research the sides before putting it in your body.


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## amateurmale

Ok I had blood drawn this morning. Just waiting for results now.


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## BIG D

cool keep us posted bro


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## amateurmale

Here it is....still needs some work but its improving. 

-This is on 4,000 to 6,000 mgs of flush niacin a day and also taking 400-600mgs of ibuprofen a day and liver is fine.


-I have no idea why estrogen is jacked up.  I took trt shot 5 days prior to withdrawal and my test is in the 800's so im clueless on estrogen.

-Also clueless on fibrinogen, maybe somebody could chime in.

-Hematocrit and RBCs will come down over time or I may just go give blood.


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## amateurmale

Wow, I guess everybody is looking at the latest greatest oral thread.


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## BIG D

what was your hdl last set of labs? i took my hdl from 4 to 37 in 4 months with some cardio and healthy fats/fish oil. not to sound discouraging, but the niacin doesnt seem like it did too much


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## amateurmale

I went up 8 points in a month. I'm goin to continue for another month then get bloods again.


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## BIG D

amateurmale said:


> I went up 8 points in a month. I'm goin to continue for another month then get bloods again.



thats about what i averaged too. this was with no niacin tho, are you doing cardio/consuming healthy fats? if not, start


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## amateurmale

Mine is slower. I'm lucky to get 4 points a month.


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## BIG D

good luck with it. dont get too caught up though, its the ratio of hdl to ldl thats important


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## amateurmale

Yes bro I know all about it.


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## amateurmale

Food for thought. After researching I found that deca raises hematocrit and rbc's substantially. That's why my hematocrit is high. I knew adrol, eq, tren etc did it but I did not know deca did.  (See below).  This is why you get bloodwork people. 



In terms of other anabolics raising your RBC, as an example, nandrolone increases RBC so significantly that it has been prescribed to patients suffering from anemia that has resulted from various diseases, as shown in the cited studies below. 

Ghorbanihaghjo, Amir. Argani, Hassan. Rohbaninoubar, Mohammad. Rashtchizadeh, Nadereh. Effect of Nandrolone Decanoate on Serum Lipoprotein (a) and its isoforms in hemodialysis patients. Lipids Health Dis. 2004 Jun 29;3:16

Johnson CA. Use of androgens in patients with renal failure. Semin Dial. 2000 Jan-Feb;13(1):36-9


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## Jhezel

amateurmale said:


> Food for thought. After researching I found that deca raises hematocrit and rbc's substantially. That's why my hematocrit is high. I knew adrol, eq, tren etc did it but I did not know deca did.  (See below).  This is why you get bloodwork people.
> 
> 
> 
> In terms of other anabolics raising your RBC, as an example, nandrolone increases RBC so significantly that it has been prescribed to patients suffering from anemia that has resulted from various diseases, as shown in the cited studies below.
> 
> Ghorbanihaghjo, Amir. Argani, Hassan. Rohbaninoubar, Mohammad. Rashtchizadeh, Nadereh. Effect of Nandrolone Decanoate on Serum Lipoprotein (a) and its isoforms in hemodialysis patients. Lipids Health Dis. 2004 Jun 29;3:16
> 
> Johnson CA. Use of androgens in patients with renal failure. Semin Dial. 2000 Jan-Feb;13(1):36-9



Well said AM, deca will significantly elevate hemocrit tremendously! If I use deca*I prefer NPP at 300mgs a week for 6 to 8 weeks max. Also, researching the effects of deca on the heart (enlarged heart). Medical journals have shown how deca has a major role on enlargement of heart, scary shit. But who knows...if this is solid evidence, but it still remains a concern in my health. Might just stick to eq instead.


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## amateurmale

Jhezel said:


> Well said AM, deca will significantly elevate hemocrit tremendously! If I use deca*I prefer NPP at 300mgs a week for 6 to 8 weeks max. Also, researching the effects of deca on the heart (enlarged heart). Medical journals have shown how deca has a major role on enlargement of heart, scary shit. But who knows...if this is solid evidence, but it still remains a concern in my health. Might just stick to eq instead.



If you're really concerned about health then stay away from deca, eq, tren, anadrol (which all increase rbc's and hematocrit like deca) and all orals. 

Id stay with test for size strength, mast for vascularity and hardness and primo for joint lubrication.


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## BIG D

everything in moderation fellas...


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## amateurmale

BIG D said:


> everything in moderation fellas...



Keep tellin yourself that. 

Deca did that after I ran it during a mini cycle for only 2 weeks post surgery at 400mgs/week.


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## Jhezel

amateurmale said:


> If you're really concerned about health then stay away from deca, eq, tren, anadrol (which all increase rbc's and hematocrit like deca) and all orals.
> 
> Id stay with test for size strength, mast for vascularity and hardness and primo for joint lubrication.



Yes indeed, test, Masteron (which I enjoy) and primo.


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## BIG D

amateurmale said:


> Keep tellin yourself that.
> 
> Deca did that after I ran it during a mini cycle for only 2 weeks post surgery at 400mgs/week.



did what, enlarge your heart, raise hematocrit? be specific


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## amateurmale

BIG D said:


> did what, enlarge your heart, raise hematocrit? be specific




raise hematocrit, raise rbc's and iron.....which will in turn enlarge your heart and raise your blood pressure.


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## BIG D

amateurmale said:


> raise *hematocrit, raise rbc's and iron*.....which will in turn enlarge your heart and raise your blood pressure.



these are temporary in most cases. as for your heart...you're not gonna permanently enlarge your heart in two weeks on deca. abuse it for 10-12 months?... sure, two weeks?.....very doubtful


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## amateurmale

BIG D said:


> these are temporary in most cases. as for your heart...you're not gonna permanently enlarge your heart in two weeks on deca. abuse it for 10-12 months?... sure, two weeks?.....very doubtful




Yes I know. I'm not going to use it all. I plan on cycling for years so years and years of use of harsh compounds does damage.  I'd rather use test, mast and primo and be safe.


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## BIG D

any updates?


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## amateurmale

Yes next week I'm getn bloods again. I'm still blasting niacin and I also added 1200 mgs nonflush niacin since it lasts longer.


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## BIG D

non flush does nothing though and can be harsh on liver....


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## amateurmale

BIG D said:


> non flush does nothing though and can be harsh on liver....



some people swear by nonflush


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## BIG D

Hmmm haven't heard this myself


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## amateurmale

Ok, after a month:

HDL went from 35 to 40
LDL from 114 to 99
Tris stayed the same at 37
Total Cholesterol went from 156 to 146

And off topic, my t3  uptake is still high and I dont know why.  It stayed the same at 42.


This isnt great but its better.


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## BIG D

this was on 4g niacin daily you said?


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## amateurmale

BIG D said:


> this was on 4g niacin daily you said?



Lol, no it was 4-4.5 grams of flush AND about 2 grams of nonflush along with fishoil and some plant sterols. 

Don't make your conclusion based on my results though. I always recover slowly.


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## BIG D

i see....glad you got your hdl/ldl back on track.


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## Slate23

Any new updates on your blood work?


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## amateurmale

Slate23 said:


> Any new updates on your blood work?



Wth?!  You're trolling this thread too?    This is too much.....Bwahahaha!


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## dorian777

amateurmale said:


> Wth?!  You're trolling this thread too?    This is too much.....Bwahahaha!



Now that's funny!


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