# Few questions



## Joe (Jun 27, 2005)

Hey guys on my first cycle, Just have a few questions. I got the pill form of test 250 and was wondering if I am taking them right. I take one pill a day on the days I workout I take one 30 minutes before I workout. On the days I dont work out I usually take them 30 minutes after I wake up. Am I doing this right? Lemme know thanks....


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

i personally have NEVER heard of Testosterone being in a pill form.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

There's a buccal lozenge that you let dissolve called Striant.  Never heard of bodybuilders using it much though.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

In pill form you wouldn't get much test out of a 250 mg tablet, that's for sure.  Joe, I think someone ripped you off on those pills.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> There's a buccal lozenge that you let dissolve called Striant.  Never heard of bodybuilders using it much though.



maybe that's why i never heard of it


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> In pill form you wouldn't get much test out of a 250 mg tablet, that's for sure.  Joe, I think someone ripped you off on those pills.



The life of it can't be that long so i agree that you won't get that much out of it


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

well, that's far from a pill though, I'm about 100% sure there is no pill form of test.


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## tee (Jun 28, 2005)

ORACLE said:
			
		

> i personally have NEVER heard of Testosterone being in a pill form.


Date of approval: June 20, 2003 


What is approved: Columbia Laboratories Inc. reports that the FDA has approved Striant (generic: testosterone buccal system), a system that slowly releases testosterone into the mucous membranes of the mouth. Striant is approved for men suffering from conditions stemming from testosterone deficiency, including hypogonadism. The Striant system offers an alternative to testosterone delivered by transdermal patches, topical gels, or injection. 

Striant is a small, curved tablet -- about the size of an aspirin -- that is placed in the small depression where the gum meets the upper lip above the front teeth. It quickly sticks. Saliva softens the tablet into a gel, which stays in place for each 12-hour dosing period. Twice-a-day dosing is required for continuous testosterone delivery. 

Testosterone delivered via the Striant delivery system doesn't go into the gut. Instead, it's absorbed by the mucous membrane and carried into a major blood vessel, the superior vena cava. 

Striant is a controlled- and sustained- release tablet-like mucoadhesive buccal (gum surface) system containing 30mg of testosterone. Striant(TM) allows for the slow release and absorption of testosterone through gum and cheek surfaces that are in contact with the product. Dosing is twice-daily, with applications in the morning and in the evening, which maintains consistent and normal levels of testosterone.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

tee said:
			
		

> Testosterone delivered via the Striant delivery system doesn't go into the gut.



sounds really medically driven....."gut" is that a medically approved term?


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

ORACLE said:
			
		

> sounds really medically driven....."gut" is that a medically approved term?




LOL.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

thanks for all the info.Yikes.... Well I talked to my friend who sells the shot, Going to try to sell these capsules and get Test 250 shots. Hes selling me a cycle for $145. That a good deal? Anything I should know or do before buying them?


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

how many shots for $145.00?  Make sure your have pins to shoot it with and proper PCT.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> thanks for all the info.Yikes.... Well I talked to my friend who sells the shot, Going to try to sell these capsules and get Test 250 shots. Hes selling me a cycle for $145. That a good deal? Anything I should know or do before buying them?



Since it's your first time......what's your idea of a cycle length and dosage?
Other questions you might want to ask him:

1. Brand
2. Price per bottle
3. Who can vouche for them to make sure it's legit


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## Zaven (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> thanks for all the info.Yikes.... Well I talked to my friend who sells the shot, Going to try to sell these capsules and get Test 250 shots. Hes selling me a cycle for $145. That a good deal? Anything I should know or do before buying them?


that's not necessarily a good deal bro.......find more info one the type of gear, etc. before buying.....


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Please tell me it's not the same guy who sold you those pills


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

If I remember correctly and I do, ANASCI has lots of good, legit sources...


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> If I remember correctly and I do, ANASCI has lots of good, legit sources...



Ding Ding Ding....we have a winnnaaaaaaaaaaaaa


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## Zaven (Jun 28, 2005)

ORACLE said:
			
		

> Please tell me it's not the same guy who sold you those pills


I was wonderin the same......


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

No, Differant guy a steroid user/Dealer I just was lookin at steroid pills the label was ripped off of mine but the bottle color and size looks legit but I guess I will never know. Yeah I dont know how many shot and stuff. He said will be taking one shot a week and he will shoot it for me. This guy wont rip me off on the stuff being real he could rip me off on the amount I get. Im going to ask the guy that sold me the pills if we will take them back. Been reading up and they seem like they mess you up


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

I would run more than 250 mg of test per week even if it is your first cycle.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Take all of that at once??


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## Zaven (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> No, Differant guy a steroid user/Dealer I just was lookin at steroid pills the label was ripped off of mine but the bottle color and size looks legit but I guess I will never know. Yeah I dont know how many shot and stuff. He said will be taking one shot a week and he will shoot it for me. This guy wont rip me off on the stuff being real he could rip me off on the amount I get. Im going to ask the guy that sold me the pills if we will take them back. Been reading up and they seem like they mess you up


trust me bro.......read the sticky's here before you do anything...


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

I'm assuming he is going to shoot you with 1 mL of 250 mg/mL test per week??  Definitely don't take it all at once.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

if you don't mind doing your own injections and getting your gear in the mail I would just order some from a good source.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Ok, Is test going to make me break out? And test will make me big? or ripped or what ?


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> if you don't mind doing your own injections and getting your gear in the mail I would just order some from a good source.


Live with my parents im 17 =D


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

It can make you break out, but it doesn't affect everyone the same.  You won't get ripped but you will get bigger as you will hold water on test, but you will gain a lot of muscle too.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

hes also got Deca 3, and winstrol


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Live with my parents im 17 =D




I would rethink using AAS at that age, you have a lot of testosterone floating in you still, just eat A LOT. and train harder than you ever have before.  Using AAS at a young age can mess you up.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Take all of that at once??



Ask him what kind of testosterone it is

Do 500mgs of testosterone per week split into two shot's.

250mgs = 1cc on the syringe

take two of those inthe week and call me in the morning.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

waiting for oracle to notice the age.  any time now....


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Live with my parents im 17 =D



Well, that's my que to stop giving advice.....other than DON'T DO STEROIDS!  Your too young and filled with natural testosterone.  Give yourself some time to grow naturally


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

LOL.  right on que Oracle.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> LOL.  right on que Oracle.



it was funny because i just read what you wrote right when i posted


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Ah, Going to use them been working out for a while senior year want to come back bigger than ever, So wich should I use Deca3 Winstrol or Test 250?


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

so, you are set on using them?  not the best idea.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Ah, Going to use them been working out for a while senior year want to come back bigger than ever, So wich should I use Deca3 Winstrol or Test 250?



None of the above


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Yes, Going to for sure use them just want to use them correctly


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Testosterone will make your balls shrivel up and will be the size of a raisin for the rest of your life.
Deca will make your dick go totally limp and you will never be able to get it up again 
Winstrol will make you go bald.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Yes, Going to for sure use them just want to use them correctly



Well Masta lifta you can have this thread.  i just hope since your hell bent on using them joe that your wise on the proper procedures....especially having someone else do them for you.  READING AND RESEARCHING CAN BE VERY ENLIGHTENING


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> Testosterone will make your balls shrivel up and will be the size of a raisin for the rest of your life.
> Deca will make your dick go totally limp and you will never be able to get it up again
> Winstrol will make you go bald.



I Just couldn't help but laugh at this


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

hahaha, lmao ok well thanks guys for your help peace!


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> hahaha, lmao ok well thanks guys for your help peace!



another satisfied youngster


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Have a good one Joe and please don't use AAS for 4 or 5 more years at the least.  You have plenty of your life left so don't screw yourself up at such a young age.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

ORACLE said:
			
		

> another satisfied youngster




LOL.  I'd say he's far from satisfied with our advice.  Any source that would sell to a 17 y.o. needs to be shot.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Well, Im trying to get really big I want to be a body builder when I grow up. Alot of my friends use them its preddy much the cool thing to do. Its not cool but Im going to do it so I get to the size I want


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Well, there are a lot of side effects you should look into before making a decision like that.  Make sure the positives outweight the negatives before you make your decision I guess.  Don't see how they could at your age though.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Ive been reading up so far just read the bad things. Little balls, Groaths, Bad acne, Man boobs, Does this happen alot?


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Do you know how to prevent Man boobs or know what post-cycle therapy is?


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Nope nothing about the man boobs, But I have read a little about like Off cycle pills and such can you explain the post cycle to me?


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> I grow up. friends use them its preddy much the cool thing to do.



yep your 17 alright.....just messing with you joe. But seriously you have alot to learn before indulging yourself in steroids.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Thats what im trying to do right now is "learn"


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

http://www.steroidinformation.com/sideeffects.htm

Look at that page and see if you really want to deal with the side effects.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Lol ive been to that site =D


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Thats what im trying to do right now is "learn"



Well then here's a lesson:

You need to learn how to be patient with your own body.  By that i mean that you'll learn that through hard work and dieting you can get just as big as those other "guys" without steroids.  However.....if you do it now your gonna "LEARN" that you should have waited because the future outcome might not be something you will be willing to live with.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Lol ive been to that site =D




Well, all of those things can and DO happen to people.  Not really funny if you start your first cycle and those things happen to you.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

ORACLE said:
			
		

> Well then here's a lesson:
> 
> You need to learn how to be patient with your own body.  By that i mean that you'll learn that through hard work and dieting you can get just as big as those other "guys" without steroids.  However.....if you do it now your gonna "LEARN" that you should have waited because the future outcome might not be something you will be willing to live with.




Teach it teacher!  Great lesson and use of the word "LEARN".  I give u an A+ for the day.  LOL.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Yeah I know what your saying, I dont really know what im going to do now. I will see Im not going to take any more of these pills though they suck


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

MaSTa LifTa said:
			
		

> Teach it teacher!  Great lesson and use of the word "LEARN".  I give u an A+ for the day.  LOL.



I twy to do me best out of my edumacations


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Yeah I know what your saying, I dont really know what im going to do now. I will see Im not going to take any more of these pills though they suck




Those pills are a total rip-off and waste of money.  Try to get your money back if you can.


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## ORACLE (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Yeah I know what your saying, I dont really know what im going to do now. I will see Im not going to take any more of these pills though they suck



Now your "Learning"


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Well Oracle, I'm gonna leave the "teaching" up to you and I'm going to bed.  Goodnight.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

I might still go and get the shots probally the test


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

But thanks for the info im out peace guys


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

You need to learn a lot before you start messin' around with testosterone.  Not a drug to be taken lightly.


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## pincrusher (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Well, Im trying to get really big I want to be a body builder when I grow up. Alot of my friends use them its preddy much the cool thing to do. Its not cool but Im going to do it so I get to the size I want


yeah, well going into school with a gun and shooting people seems to be a cool thing to do with kids right now so does that mean you will do it also?

just because something is cool amongst ill-informed kids does not mean its ok to do it.  how much do you value your future health?


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## pincrusher (Jun 28, 2005)

it seems your gym source is so intent on selling you some gear that he has not educated you at all on how to use it properly or what to use with it.  this way he can keep selling you more gear without you ever knowing if you are taking it correctly.

before you allow anyone to stick a needle in your backside, you better find out all you can about nutritional needs when on steroids because without having a proper meal plan in place, those shots will do nothing more for ya than cause some irritation to your derrier.
do you really think that just taking steroids will make ya get huge?  you need to eat huge to get huge and not just take steroids.


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## steve0085 (Jun 28, 2005)

He's gonna do it no matter what we say, he's made up his mind.  I only hope he doesn't fuck himself up, not for his sake, but i don't want to see another damn story on the news about some skinny ass punk ass teenager using steroids incorrectly and causing themselves great harm.  Good luck bro, and you better hope that if you fuck up the news doesn't find out about it.


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## MdTNT (Jun 28, 2005)

Buddy, i caught this thread so late and I wish I had seen it ssoner. At your age you can do a lot mroe damage to your body by experimenting with AAS than if you were to wait. You can screw up your receptors for ever and thats just the beggining. Best recomendation that every one seems to be telling you is to wait. Educate your self and learn what is right and wrong. It's sad that so many kids now days seem to think that AAS is a magical pill or shot taht will make you grow miraculously huge muscles. I hate to be the beareer of ill tidings but this is so far from the truth. If you wanna grow especially at your age then eat eat eat eat eat....by thew way, did i mention eat. Propper diet and training along with rest are teh best anabolics you can do for a few yrs. I wish i still ahd the same natural test levels now that i did at 17. Knowing is half the battle little bro'...stick to the site and learn, educate your self on the propper implicatiojn of a diet and trainging plan and put it to use. Md


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## MdTNT (Jun 28, 2005)

pincrusher said:
			
		

> it seems your gym source is so intent on selling you some gear that he has not educated you at all on how to use it properly or what to use with it.  this way he can keep selling you more gear without you ever knowing if you are taking it correctly.
> 
> before you allow anyone to stick a needle in your backside, you better find out all you can about nutritional needs when on steroids because without having a proper meal plan in place, those shots will do nothing more for ya than cause some irritation to your derrier.
> do you really think that just taking steroids will make ya get huge?  you need to eat huge to get huge and not just take steroids.



Yup Pin, I couldn't agree with you more...this kids gym source sounds more like a street level pusher selling recreational drugs at the play ground of the local elementry school. Md


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## STEELADDICTION (Jun 28, 2005)

MdTNT said:
			
		

> Buddy, i caught this thread so late and I wish I had seen it ssoner. At your age you can do a lot mroe damage to your body by experimenting with AAS than if you were to wait. You can screw up your receptors for ever and thats just the beggining. Best recomendation that every one seems to be telling you is to wait. Educate your self and learn what is right and wrong. It's sad that so many kids now days seem to think that AAS is a magical pill or shot taht will make you grow miraculously huge muscles. I hate to be the beareer of ill tidings but this is so far from the truth. If you wanna grow especially at your age then eat eat eat eat eat....by thew way, did i mention eat. Propper diet and training along with rest are teh best anabolics you can do for a few yrs. I wish i still ahd the same natural test levels now that i did at 17. Knowing is half the battle little bro'...stick to the site and learn, educate your self on the propper implicatiojn of a diet and trainging plan and put it to use. Md



Couldn't have said it better than you and PIN.  Although I will stress that taking steroids at 17 years old could actually stunt your bodies natural ability to grow.  I did almost 2 years of research before my first cycle at the age of 29.  I'm not going to flame you bro, but do some F---ing research.  You obviously haven't read much or you would realize the harm and side effects you could cause to your body at your age.  I'm sick of young PUNKS always taking the easy road.  Have you even tried a good diet and a well structured lifting plan?  Your going to cheat your body of years of NATURAL growth.  Wise up bro!


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

My source is a guy that just graduated from my highschool he was about the smallest kid there until he did some steroids. Im trying to get real cut not really BIG, Steroids would give me the body I wanted for modeling and shit. My source said he would teach me how to do it right. He looks like he did it right I know hes done at least 2 cycles maybe even 3. Eversince I got these pills ive been eating ALOT at least 6 meals a day sometimes healthy sometimes not. I just figured I would get bigger faster with steroids. Ive been reading alot about steroids I just havnt found any information on where and how to inject yourself. What I need to do while im on the cycle and what to do after the cycle. I know I have to be on a good diet etc. Im trying to get ripped before I got back to school for the lady's. Ive got from here till august 17th.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

Well, those pills had nothing to do with you eating A LOT.  Testosterone taken orally will not get into your system in any significant amount.  There isn't even a pill form of testosterone that you can swallow produced.  I don't know what your source gave you, but it wasn't testosterone, and if it was it won't do you any good.


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## STEELADDICTION (Jun 28, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> My source is a guy that just graduated from my highschool he was about the smallest kid there until he did some steroids. Im trying to get real cut not really BIG, Steroids would give me the body I wanted for modeling and shit. My source said he would teach me how to do it right. He looks like he did it right I know hes done at least 2 cycles maybe even 3. Eversince I got these pills ive been eating ALOT at least 6 meals a day sometimes healthy sometimes not. I just figured I would get bigger faster with steroids. Ive been reading alot about steroids I just havnt found any information on where and how to inject yourself. What I need to do while im on the cycle and what to do after the cycle. I know I have to be on a good diet etc. Im trying to get ripped before I got back to school for the lady's. Ive got from here till august 17th.



Here's my advice bro, read up on on a good diet and training.  Then get off your dead ass and get to the gym and train HARD!  As for steroids, you'll get no advice from me.  Your to young and obviously imature.  Hopefully you will wait at least 2 years, and in that time you will eat right, train right and most important, come up with a better reason to do AAS than "getting ripped for the ladies"!


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Okay, I will find my information somewhere else.


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## MaSTa LifTa (Jun 28, 2005)

> This webpage and website are for informational reasons only. To enter anasci.org you must be at least 18 years old.



That's from the start page of the website.  There's a reason for that being there.


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## steve0085 (Jun 28, 2005)

That's why I hate those punk ass kids, They ask for advice, but when they don't hear what they want they just say "I DON'T NEED YOU"  I bet his daddy bought his car and he tells him the same thing.  He must have a pretty big allowance to afford those TEST pills.  He just doesn't want to work hard at getting big, so he thinks steroids are magic juice.  I hope he wastes his money and gets nothing out of gear other than shrunken nuts and a stunted growth.


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## Joe (Jun 28, 2005)

Your so wrong, Ive been lifting weights On and off since 7th grade. I pay for everything my self I have a job at a golf course that makes just enough to pay for my gas and insurance and a little extra, Nice how you can talk shit about a 17 year old kid over the internet. I bet you feel real big doing that. My parents dont pay for anything I get ZERO allowance. I have been lifting weights and I am just not impressed anymore with the results. Im not going to take them anymore Ive read up on some better diets im going to try out. If they dont work as well as I want then im going to go buy some shots.


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## max lift (Jun 28, 2005)

you have recieved good info from some vets that know their shit and you refuse to listen to it , steroids are bad for you when your body has not developed yet at your age shutting down your natural test could cause you problems down the road , try and post that you are 17 and going to do roids on any other board and I am shure that the responce you get will not be nearly as helpfull.

Here is my advice post your weight height and BF% and mabie we can help with plan to get you going in the right direction , diet is king if you dont eat you wont grow no madder how much drugs you take ,


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## steve0085 (Jun 28, 2005)

Yeah, probably a little harsh what i said.  Too much testosterone.  But seriously, at your age if you're not gaining then you're doing something wrong.  The diet is a big factor, you should take in around 4000 calories a day, and try to get 2 grams protein per pound of body weight. also you might not be lifting hard enough, or you could be doing the same workout too much.  Try switching your routine, switch the days, or change your split.  If you're using high reps(over 8) do weights that you can lift for 3-6 reps for a while, or if you're doing low reps do the opposite.  Don't train any body part more than once every 5 days.  Any of this could be your problem, but at your age your body is producing so much TEST that it's like your on gear already, so no need to take any because that'll just make your body stop making it's own.


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## MdTNT (Jun 28, 2005)

max lift said:
			
		

> you have recieved good info from some vets that know their shit and you refuse to listen to it , steroids are bad for you when your body has not developed yet at your age shutting down your natural test could cause you problems down the road , try and post that you are 17 and going to do roids on any other board and I am shure that the responce you get will not be nearly as helpfull.
> 
> Here is my advice post your weight height and BF% and mabie we can help with plan to get you going in the right direction , diet is king if you dont eat you wont grow no madder how much drugs you take ,



Excellent advice bro'....


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## Joe (Jun 30, 2005)

I weigh 145, height is 5foot 7inches.......My routine now is, I workout every other day I starting working out twice a day yesterday. I go in and bench press 3 sets of regular bench press and 3 sets of close grip. Then I go get 2 dumbells and get the weight i can curl about 6 times do 3 sets of those. I go to the cable machine and do the triceps 10 reps 3 sets, Preddy much those are the only muscles I concentrate on, Squats hurt my knees but I need to do something for my legs. I need strong lower body for wrestleing. So I just run about 2 miles a day, I figure running would get me ripped as well, thats about what I do everyother day and of course eat alot. What I want is just a good looking upper body, Back muscles, arms, abs, pec's


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## Joe (Jun 30, 2005)

Do you think I should continue taking these pills? I dont know wtf they are now that you guys say there is no such thing as test pills.


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## ORACLE (Jun 30, 2005)

ok forget steroids for now what you need is a solid workout plan.  The one you posted isn't enough to stimulate the muscle groups.  I wrestled in high school and having a overall developed body is better than just having a strong upper body.


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## Joe (Jun 30, 2005)

Yeah that is correct. I just want to look bigger preddy much, I dont really care about wrestleing next year as much I dont want to go to college...heh Well Ive been reading muscle and fitness mags lately to figure out a good routine.


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## pincrusher (Jun 30, 2005)

you need to break down your workouts into specific muscle groups for each workout. dont do more than 2 muscle groups at a time, preferibly a large & small group such as chest & tri's or back & bi's together. it should look something like this:
monday: chest & tri's
tuesday: back & bi's
wednesday: off
thursday: legs= quads, hamstrings 
friday: shoulders & calves
sat & sunday: off

try to do 2 sets of light weight for the first exercise for each muscle being worked then jump to your heavy sets using weight you can move for 6-10 good reps to failure.  use 2 exercises per muscle being worked & 3 working sets for each exercise.
go to the local health food store(gnc or vitamin world)  and get yourself some creatine & glutamine powder and start using that instead of those supposed test pills.  take the creatine 30 minutes preworkout & also immediately post workout at a dosage of 5 grams each time.  the glutamine should be taken with the creatine and also 2 other times during the day at 5grams each dosage.
get a good protein powder and start drinking 2 shakes per day, one post cycle with the creatine/glutamine & the other when you get up in the morning before breakfast.
plan out 6 meals per day at an average of 600-700 cals with 50 grams of protein as the suggested dosage.  eat lots of chicken, tuna, some lean beef, cottage cheese before bed,  EFA'S (good fats) such as olive oil, flax oil,  potatoes, brown rice, eggs(preferably the whites with only a few yokes)

this should start ya towards your goals without having to use steroids.
with what you desire to acheive, it can be done with diet & proper training techniques and without steroids.  all you need to do is eat clean, add cardio to your daily routine, train hard and you will see the results you want.


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## max lift (Jun 30, 2005)

good looking routine I have been looking to change mine up a bit I will give this one a try,


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## Joe (Jul 1, 2005)

Nice routine man, Thanks alot Ill do a little before and after pic so we can see. Thanks... But I have one question, Wont the creatine make my muscles soft?


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## steve0085 (Jul 1, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Nice routine man, Thanks alot Ill do a little before and after pic so we can see. Thanks... But I have one question, Wont the creatine make my muscles soft?


Creatine will make some people hold a little more water, but it's nothing to worry about because you're going for mass, it's pretty hard to gain mass and get ripped and hard at the same time.  Spend some time to gain the mass and then you can cut the creatine to get rid of the water.


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## Joe (Jul 1, 2005)

Alright, What about about Ripped fuel? Will that help with the ripped part?


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## steve0085 (Jul 1, 2005)

I'm not familiar with the ingredients, but I think it's just for energy.  When you're trying to gain mass you're inevitable going to put on a little fat because you're eating so much, you just burn that off later with cardio.


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## mr.nitrofish (Jul 1, 2005)

joe, if your going to do steroids you need to take this seriously. you need to know what your taking, the company who makes it and how to treat the side effects. all these side effects are real, I personally have tiny balls because of testosterone and I know another guy with boobs. another guy I know has stunted his growth bigtime, its sad because he has good bulk but he's very short.

also what do you consider a good cycle? this is not something you can just take and then stop whenever.
all im asking is to do a little more research.


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## pincrusher (Jul 1, 2005)

Joe said:
			
		

> Nice routine man, Thanks alot Ill do a little before and after pic so we can see. Thanks... But I have one question, Wont the creatine make my muscles soft?


just remember joe, there will always be people here who want to help but you must at least exhibit the desire to listen and learn from all us veterans who have tried it all and have a good working knowledge of not just gear usage but also nutritional needs & training protocol(just ignor ar spellin  )
to many of our young generation come on message boards with the attitude that either they know it all or they dont care about potential side affects from gear.  you have at least shown that you can change your beliefs if the info is presented in a positive way.

for your workout routine i also wanted to add that you should go heavy for about 4-5 weeks then switch up and drop your poundages by about 30% and up the reps to the 12-15 range. do your workouts like this for 2-3 weeks then switch back to the low rep heavy ass weight again.    this will allow your body some recovery time from going heavy all the time and will help you to continually see gains instead of hitting plateau's
ripped fuel will work for loosing fat. i actually use lipo-6 by nutrex and it seems to be working very well for me.  fat loss is best done with a good cardio program to run along with a fat burner product. the results will be much better than just relying on the fat burner.
any other questions feel free to ask either here in the forum or you can pm me to talk privately.


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## G2G (Jul 1, 2005)

could the pills be andriol(restandol).its oral test undecanoate
 i got this from another website.....................Andriol comes under the names Androxon, Understor and Restinsol. This is an oral steroid and it`s presented in little, oval-shaped, red capsules. An oil which contains the testosterone is inside of these capsules. Andriol is a unique steroid in that it is not an alpha alkylated 17 steroid. The only bad thing about this base is that it only allows the testosterone to remain active in the system for several hours. Thus frequent administration of the capsules is necessary. Aromatization is minimal with this agent. Those are 40 mg brown colored miniature "rugby balls" by ORGANON of Europe. Each oval capsule is marked DV3 ORGANON on it. Dosage is 3 to 6 caps a day, and costs about $ 1.50 a cap. Andriol is a safe oral steroid that does not supress gonadotrophins.


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## G2G (Jul 1, 2005)

more on oral test.........
Andriol (testosterone undecanoate) 

Andriol is a unique oral testosterone product, developed by the international drug firm Organon. One of the more recently developed anabolic steroids, Andrioi first became available in the early 1980's. This compound contains 40 mg of testosterone undecanoate, based in oil (oleic acid) and sealed inside a capsule. Subtracting the ester weight, this equates to a dosage of approximately 25mg of raw testosterone per cap. The design of this steroid is quite different from that of most oral steroids. Drugs administered orally generally enter the blood stream through the liver. When a steroid compound is given this way without some form of structural protection, it will be quickly broken down during the "first pass". This process leaves very little steroid intact, basically deactivating the drug. Adding a methyl group (c-17 AA) to the structure is one way to protect it from this process, however stress is also placed on the liver as a result. In some instances this stress can lead to actual damage to liver tissues, so the designers of this steroid sought another way to protect the testosterone molecule. With Andriol, this was accomplished by making a form of testosterone that would be absorbed through the lymphatic system. This is due to its high fat solubility brought about by the ester, and its suspension in oil. Having the compound absorbed this way was thought to be very advantageous, as it allows the steroid to bypass the destructive first-pass through liver. This should permit the compound to enter the blood stream intact, without the need for a harsh chemical alteration. The ester breaks off once it is in circulation of course, yielding free active Pharmacokinetics of Orai Testosterone testosterone. In design this steroid appears to be undecanoate that of a completely liver safe and orally active form of testosterone.

On paper this drug seems like an ideal oral testosterone product. Clean, safe and worlds apart from other oral testosterone derivatives like the crude methyltestosterone. But as we always hear in life, if it looks to good to be true, it probably is. And there are definitely some issues with Andriol®. The first problem is that bioavailability, although clearly worlds apart from trying to take straight testosterone orally, is probably not significant next to c17alpha alkylated orals. Athletes typically find that in doses of less than 240mg per day (6 capsules) effects are generally not seen at all. 240mg of testosterone ester daily, the primary male androgen, and only a meager effect. When doses go higher, maybe 8-10 capsules (320-400mg), new muscle growth is slight to moderate at best, but no incredible bulky gains are ever reported. Logic leads one to think that only a little testosterone is making its way into circulation. Testosterone is a powerful hormone no matter what the ester or form of administration. If it were active in the blood stream, the results would have to be pronounced. When one injects an oil based testosterone ester like cypionate, a dosage of 400mg per week is more than sufficient. 400mg Andriol per day should be packing on an incredible amount of mass. Where does it all go? Individual problems with absorption may play into things here. The graph above shows the median response noted when this drug was given to a group of women. It does not however depict the striking differences in individual metabolism that were noted in this experiment. If we look at results from each of four subjects, the differences are dramatic to say the least. While one is off the scale with testosterone levels, another barely budges at all. What is even more confusing is that results were so inconsistent, that at times higher levels were achieved with a lower 20mg dose compared to the 40mg when given to the same subject. Clearly there is little to be said except that this drug is unpredictable in its ability to be absorbed and utilized by the body. While one day you might be getting great absorption, perhaps the next day you are getting very little. Studies with men were no better than with women, where again this drug was shown to be unpredictably absorbed and utilized with blood levels ranging from 11.5 to 60.1 nmol/L with 80mg twice daily49.

One might also pay interest to the "mildness" of this compound as described by other bodybuilding materials. Ar~driol® is often spoken about as some type of magic product, which to spite being a form of regular testosterone somehow allows for only minimal estrogen conversion. You should know that the way a drug is administered includes a number of factors that can slightly alter its effect, the most predominant being the speed of release. This effects the time it takes for a peak blood level to be reached, and likely the length it takes to see results. The primary reason Testosterone suspension seems more powerful than enanthate is because more drug is active on day one. At the same time estrogen builds up faster and side effects become pronounced very quickly. The ester is also part of the total weight, and 100mg testosterone contains a much larger quantity of testosterone molecules that testosterone plus ester, another reason for varying effect. But these changes do not amount to all that much. The structure of testosterone is what allows it to break down into estrogen. The only way we can really prevent an androgen from converting to estrogen is to change the base molecule, not the ester. Once free in the blood stream we cannot prevent testosterone from being aromatized without interfering with the aromatase enzyme itself. The lack of results and side effects often reported with Andriol® must be going hand in hand with poor absorption.

Most athletes today consider Andriol a very poor buy. I know other references do find use for this drug, which is defendable because some amount of steroid clearly does enter the blood stream in tact. Technically it is still an oral testosterone, and definitely does not carry the same liver-toxicity risks associated with most steroids designed for this type of administration, so all is not Post. Those specifically looking for a mild oral at times do purchase this product, and occasionally are even satisfied with their results. But for most its high price and required high daily dosages usually causes them to avoided it when crossing it on the black market. Besides, if we want a mild steroid the last thing we really should shop for is a testosterone.


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## Joe (Jul 1, 2005)

The pills I took were White unmarked capsules and your suppose to take 2 a day, I made the mistake of buying them and not knowing what they were I wish I could take them to a test lab or something and see what they are. They came from mexico the bottle it came in had the label ripped off the top was black and the bottle is white. Tommorow im going to go get Some creatine, Maybe the new Ce2. Im also going to get protein and glutamine like pincrusher said. I will start on my new workout routine on monday. Pin- I have seen lipo 6 in the magazines, Looks like it is $$. I think I will just get the $15 ripped fuel. I try to run everyday at least 1 or 2 miles to get ripped, Maybe this will help more. Ok so I have taken about 1 1/2 weeks worth of the Pills, Do I need to do anything? Will anything bad happen since I just stopped taking them?


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## steve0085 (Jul 1, 2005)

They were probably just generic asprins or tylenol so you don't have to worry about stopping


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## Joe (Jul 1, 2005)

lmao, I will beat the f*** out of the dealer if thats true


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## steve0085 (Jul 2, 2005)

if he told you they were test pills you got ripped off, no such thing.  And if he's gonna rip you off like that, i doubt he sold you any steroids, just fakes


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## STEELADDICTION (Jul 2, 2005)

Glad to see that your going at this smart and natural for now bro.  I hope some of us wern't to hard on you, we just want the best for you at your age.  You have A LOT of natural growing ahead of you.  Pay close attention to PIN, he's one of the best here at Anasci!


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## Joe (Jul 2, 2005)

I do, I copyed down what he said so I can take it with me into the gym on monday


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