# My Back Surgery



## Jim550 (Feb 9, 2020)

So I've had back pain for quite sometime, it was debilitating and got worse and worse.  I could only stand for 1-2 mins before EVERYTHING waist down to the bottom of my feet was completely numb then followed with intense pain.  I had MRI's and a CT's down.  My L4-L-5 disc was really thin and worn out and protruding.  At my L5-S1 my spine had shifted at least 50% which was a crazy amount, they normally measure people's shifts in mm mine was in cm. I also no longer had any disc at my L5-S1 and it was bone on bone. They also found they I had a broken bone off one of my vertebrae's which was putting a lot of pressure on nerves as if there wasn't already enough with everything else, so I was quite depressed for awhile as I really couldn't do anything.

I found one of the best neurosurgeons in the country that specializes in spines.

The Surgery:  They first went in my back and realigned spine and used screws and rods to accomplish that, they removed that broken bone an did a bone graph from my understanding. They did a Posterolateral Lumbar Fusion with an Anterior Interbody Fusion.  So when they closed my back up they then went in through the stomach to the other fusion and but in disc implants that were part plastic material and steel wrapped and the disc implant had donor bone in the middle and they screwd those in from the front into the donor bone.. So they got me from the front and back they called it a 360 and fused from the L-4 to S-1.  They also put in screws in my iliac to reinforce and strengthen everything..


Let me tell you about pain it was unreal!


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## Otis T Holbrook (Feb 9, 2020)

Sounds terrible, I hope the surgery fixes everything for you. Were you a heavy squatter? Big t-bar rows?


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## Concreteguy (Feb 9, 2020)

Good God man. Sounds terrible. You and poor BIO have gone through hell and back dealing with spine issues.
 How will your training be effected as a result of this?


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## *Bio* (Feb 9, 2020)

I feel your pain man!

- L4-5, L5-s1 Laminectomy - 1998
- L4-5, L5-s1 Fusion - Dec 2014
- C5-6, C6-7 Fusion - Aug 2015
- C7-T1 Fusion - June 2018
- C4-5 Foraminotomy & Laminectomy - Oct 2018
- C4-5 Fused From Ankylosing Spondylitis
- L2-3 Microdiscectomy - Dec 2018
- As I listed above, I have Ankylosing Spondylitis. It's an auto immune disease that is an arthritis/inflammatory disease. It causes arthritis and fusions of the spine and and other joints of the body.  I take Humira for it.

That L4-s1 fusion was a very painful recovery!  The surgery was one thing but then, unbeknownst to me, I had the AS on top of it (wasn't diagnosed yet) which caused extreme inflammation on top of the normal surgical recovery pain.  But what can you do? LOL!  Just heal as best we can and start getting quality of life back.

So where are you at in the recovery process now with PT, lifting, etc?


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## Jim550 (Feb 9, 2020)

*Bio* said:


> I feel your pain man!
> 
> - L4-5, L5-s1 Laminectomy - 1998
> - L4-5, L5-s1 Fusion - Dec 2014
> ...



I just got out of the hospital little less than 2 weeks ago.  So I'm not really doing anything but walking with a walker (I don't rely on the walker its just there for safety purposes) a few times a day. I probably walk a few hundred feet at a time.  I just got my stables out of the stomach and back the other day,  I was doing few PT exercises 2 x day that the PT guy in the hospital wanted me doing but the nurse at my neurosurgeon office said not to since there wasn't any PT personnel there at home with me.  all of them are seated so I think I am going to start doing them again they don't cause any threat of my falling.  They pain has been awful especially the few days after the surgery as they couldn't control my pain at all since I was on a lot Percocet's prior to surgery, the brought in a pain management team and switched my drugs around and tried a few different things till they found a protocol that made it bearable.


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## Jim550 (Feb 9, 2020)

Otis T Holbrook said:


> Sounds terrible, I hope the surgery fixes everything for you. Were you a heavy squatter? Big t-bar rows?



Thanks man.  I used to squat heavy but gave it up a long time ago for real deep squats with 225 a more reps.  I did do pretty heavy  T bar and close grip with a barbell in the corner.  I also wrestled for many years when I was younger.  One PA of surgeon I first saw but did not go with for the surgery said I could have been born with the condition.


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## *Bio* (Feb 10, 2020)

Jim550 said:


> I just got out of the hospital little less than 2 weeks ago.  So I'm not really doing anything but walking with a walker (I don't rely on the walker its just there for safety purposes) a few times a day. I probably walk a few hundred feet at a time.  I just got my stables out of the stomach and back the other day,  I was doing few PT exercises 2 x day that the PT guy in the hospital wanted me doing but the nurse at my neurosurgeon office said not to since there wasn't any PT personnel there at home with me.  all of them are seated so I think I am going to start doing them again they don't cause any threat of my falling.  They pain has been awful especially the few days after the surgery as they couldn't control my pain at all since I was on a lot Percocet's prior to surgery, the brought in a pain management team and switched my drugs around and tried a few different things till they found a protocol that made it bearable.



Be careful doing anything PT related this soon.  Listen to the surgeon and not the PT in the hospital.  I never had any type of PT until 2 months post op.  A member at PM, Stumpy, had a lumbar fusion surgery and the PT at the hospital had him doing exercises right away.  He screwed up his surgery and is in a lot of pain!  He told his surgeon and the surgeon said, "I didn't prescribe any PT for you" and wasn't happy.  Waaay too early.  Just rest and recover.  I never had a walker for mine.  I just walked slowly with small steps.


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## Jim550 (Feb 10, 2020)

Concreteguy said:


> Good God man. Sounds terrible. You and poor BIO have gone through hell and back dealing with spine issues.
> How will your training be effected as a result of this?



That's a good question, I really don't know yet since it's so recent not even 2 weeks.  I've been out of the gym for a long time now since my back had been messed up for quit sometime before surgery and didn't have insurance for awhile, I could have gone and did some seated things I guess but I was just down about the whole situation.  I'vr put on a lot of bf since but my outlook has completely changed since my surgery and can't waite to get back in the gym.  I did a ton of research on spine surgeons and was lucky to find one of the very best in the nation and world locally who is a Neurosurgeon that specializes in just spines.  We talked about my past in bodybuilding and competing and he thought he could get me back to where I was and will be able to do it again.  He said the surgery went excellent so thats great news.  One of the ladies on his team told me her brother had the same surgery and he was able to get him back doing jiu jitsu so that was encouraging.  I see him again this week and am going to talk to him more about my PT and when I will be able to start training again.


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## Jim550 (Feb 10, 2020)

*Bio* said:


> Be careful doing anything PT related this soon.  Listen to the surgeon and not the PT in the hospital.  I never had any type of PT until 2 months post op.  A member at PM, Stumpy, had a lumbar fusion surgery and the PT at the hospital had him doing exercises right away.  He screwed up his surgery and is in a lot of pain!  He told his surgeon and the surgeon said, "I didn't prescribe any PT for you" and wasn't happy.  Waaay too early.  Just rest and recover.  I never had a walker for mine.  I just walked slowly with small steps.



THANK YOU!!!!!!!  He had me squeezing me knees together with a pillow in the middle, glute squeezes, seated knee marching, and seated extending your leg out straight and then moving the foot to the outside and holding for 2-3 seconds.


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## Jim550 (Feb 10, 2020)

*Bio* said:


> Be careful doing anything PT related this soon.  Listen to the surgeon and not the PT in the hospital.  I never had any type of PT until 2 months post op.  A member at PM, Stumpy, had a lumbar fusion surgery and the PT at the hospital had him doing exercises right away.  He screwed up his surgery and is in a lot of pain!  He told his surgeon and the surgeon said, "I didn't prescribe any PT for you" and wasn't happy.  Waaay too early.  Just rest and recover.  I never had a walker for mine.  I just walked slowly with small steps.



Did they go in from both the back and front for your L4-S1 like they did with mine?


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## *Bio* (Feb 10, 2020)

Jim550 said:


> Did they go in from both the back and front for your L4-S1 like they did with mine?



Just Anterior, through the front.  I don't have any rods. Here is a picture of my L4-s1 fusion.  My L4-s1 Laminectomy and L2-3 Microdiscectomy were through the back.

You're going to be ok.  I was so grateful once I healed.  I don't deadlift or squat.  Life will be different on that end but even as far as range of motion goes, it's almost the same.  

When I got out of the hospital it was a Saturday.  I was really happy to get out because there was a big UFC fight on that I wanted to watch.  I got home, moving very slow, in fact every little bump on the ride home was murder.  I got myself propped up in bed, we have an electric box frame, and I remember watching these guys and realizing how helpless I was.  If someone broke into the house, I would have just told them to leave us alone and take whatever you want..LOL!  I'm sure you understand!!  

BTW, those exercises sound ok.  I'm glad you're not doing anything that puts pressure on the low back!

There are a lot of us here that have had some serious issues and we don't give up.  CG's recent brush with death showed his resolve.  Whenever I have a surgery, I measure my recovery down the road on my return to the gym.  It's a lifestyle and ingrained in me.  I've made the adjustments I've had to make but I always return and do it smart.  I don't let ego get in the way.  It's about quality of life and longevity in the gym for me.  Hats off to those of you that have had injuries, illness, adversity and keep coming back!!


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## Jim550 (Feb 11, 2020)

*Bio* said:


> Just Anterior, through the front.  I don't have any rods. Here is a picture of my L4-s1 fusion.  My L4-s1 Laminectomy and L2-3 Microdiscectomy were through the back.
> 
> You're going to be ok.  I was so grateful once I healed.  I don't deadlift or squat.  Life will be different on that end but even as far as range of motion goes, it's almost the same.
> 
> ...



LOL every bump on the way home was murder!!!   I have an electric base to that does legs, lumbar, upper body lift and head tilt it definitely helps out and I have a new Sleep Number 360 iLE which is so amazing.  I definitely feel the same way on the helplessness like you said.  Thanks for the encouraging words brother!


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## Jim550 (Feb 14, 2020)

*A look at my back (x-rays)*

here's 1


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## Jim550 (Feb 14, 2020)

2


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## Jim550 (Feb 14, 2020)

3


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## Jim550 (Feb 14, 2020)

4


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## ASHOP (Feb 14, 2020)

That's some serious stuff my friend. Those x-rays are telling. Hope you continue to progress and get well soon.


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## Jim550 (Feb 14, 2020)

ASHOP said:


> That's some serious stuff my friend. Those x-rays are telling. Hope you continue to progress and get well soon.



Thanks, did you see how long those Iliac Crest/pelvis screws are?  They are serious, cause some major pain.


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## pitshack (Feb 15, 2020)

I actually had a hard time looking at those pics. Best of luck to you my man and I wish you a speedy recovery so you can get back to hitting it at the gym.


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## odin (Feb 16, 2020)

Those screws look very long. The pain must be bad. Seeing your pics make me want to change my back training. I can see similar issues ahead if I carry on with heavy deadlifts.


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## Jim550 (Feb 16, 2020)

Thanks Pitshack.

ODin, ya they are very long I didn't expect them to be that long and they are painful as f*ck. I can only imagine the look of the of them drilling them in. They help reinforce everything and give extra stability, since my spine had shifted so much and had to do so much realignment since the shift was around 50% on L-5 to S1 he definitely wanted to put them in or said if he didn't there would be a good chance down the road that he would need to.  What isn't easy to see in the photos is the disc implants they put in.


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## Supermofo (Mar 1, 2020)

How's the recovery comin along Jim?


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## Jim550 (Mar 19, 2020)

*UPDATE*



Supermofo said:


> How's the recovery comin along Jim?



hey brother sorry for the late reply and thanks for asking, my back seems to be getting better! Since surgery I haven't had the numbness and pain I did after being on my feet for only a couple minutes which was completely waist down.  I take a few minutes walks about twice a day and no real pain while doing so, my balance is a little off sometimes but not bad.  Still obviously have back pain and some pain from the iliac crest screws they put in but nothing like recently after the surgery.  My biggest issues is still having some bad nerve pain in my feet which when it started was pretty unbearable but it has improved some and is mostly just in my right foot now.  I am now using a bone stimulator so hopefully that is helping, I am suppose to get another CT towards the end of the month and see my neurosurgeon the beginning of next month so I am interested in finding out what it shows.

Here's the real BS my primary writes all my pain meds and meds post surgery as the surgeon does not write scripts.  Just the other day they called me and told me I failed my drug test which was a false positive since I only take exactly what she prescribes me.  So I would normally be seeing her next week to refill my scripts and am on 6 10mg Percocet/day, she also prescribes Valium(which is a Benzo) which I am don't take much of cause it makes tired and am going to be discontinuing it soon, I also take a muscle relaxer, and gabapentin.  They called and told me I failed my drug test and am on other Benzos(things I have never even heard of) as well as the Valium and dismissed me as a patient.  So know I am left with a little more than a week of my normal Percocet dose that I am just supposed to ween my self off of in about a week! So I did some research and the failed drug test(false positive) is due to the way the Valium Metabolizes and states it in the FDA Valium insert package.  I told them about it and they didn't give a fck and acted like I was wrong cause the urine test is soo reliable and wasn't even allowed to talk to my Dr.  Below I will paste the metabolism part of the valium insert from the FDA which are the exact drugs that showed up in my system.  So know I'm trying to find a Dr. that will help me before I have to deal with a very unpleasant withdrawl and more pain.

Metabolism
Diazepam is N-demethylated by CYP3A4 and 2C19 to the active metabolite N-desmethyldiazepam, and is hydroxylated by CYP3A4 to the active metabolite temazepam. N-desmethyldiazepam and temazepam are both further metabolized to oxazepam. Temazepam and oxazepam are largely eliminated by glucuronidation.


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## *Bio* (Mar 19, 2020)

Find a pain management doctor/clinic ASAP and explain it to them.  The withdrawal won't be fun if you can't this figured out quickly!


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## Jim550 (Mar 23, 2020)

*Bio* said:


> Find a pain management doctor/clinic ASAP and explain it to them.  The withdrawal won't be fun if you can't this figured out quickly!



Thanks Bio, I had already started the search when I posted about it.  It took a little searching, especially during these times with some going to phone call visits only due to the virus which are only for existing patients but I found one and am seeing him in a couple days.  

I'm still having bad nerve pain in the feet, mostly just one of them which I hope will end soon as it is miserable.  I have been putting on some oils for it and some prescription lidocaine on it which helps but only for a certain amount of time. If anyone has any suggestions for it I'm all ears...


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## 69cyclerider (Mar 28, 2020)

Jim, are you using Gabapentine for the nerve pain ?


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## RedBird (Mar 29, 2020)

Wow ! Hope you get some relief


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## Jim550 (Apr 22, 2020)

69cyclerider said:


> Jim, are you using Gabapentine for the nerve pain ?



Yes I'm on gabapentin @ 600mg x 4 times per day, my nerve pain has got much better in the feet and almost completely gone which I am so grateful for cause it was really bad.


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## Jim550 (Apr 22, 2020)

BIO,

Do you think I'm good to start my gh I'm right about 3 months post surgery.   I haven't been able to find that thread from Gotgame on PM regarding it...


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## GearPro (Apr 23, 2020)

Damn Jim. That looks rough. Hope your able to heal up and have a high quality of life, bro.


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## Jim550 (Apr 23, 2020)

GearPro said:


> Damn Jim. That looks rough. Hope your able to heal up and have a high quality of life, bro.



It was rough bro but it's getting much better.  I'm moving around pretty good and walking a good distance now.  I think I'm gonna start doing some baby squats.  I think I'll start taking some gh tonight @ 2iu's/day for a week and then bump it up to 3iu


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## Jim550 (May 20, 2020)

*update*

Just wanted to update that things have been getting better, I started physical therapy last week going 3 x week and am also doing stretches and exercises daily at home and walk around the neighborhood as well.  I see my doctor on Neurosurgeon on the 27th and will probably start going to the gym and start doing some machine workouts after that.  I started Mauvetop Hgh last week.  I am still taking some pain medicine but have definitely cut down on them which is good since taking them for over a year has caused addiction to them. Currently my supplements are:

300mg Test Cyp/wk
Mauvetop 3iu/day at night to help with sleep
TN Whole Food Vitamin 3 x day (awesome vitamin, highly recommend)
TN EAA's 1-2 x day
TN Citruline Malate w/ AAKG(arginine) 1-2 x day
TN Taurine 1-2 x day
TN Joint Supplement 2 x day


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## Viking (May 21, 2020)

Crazy. I am pleased you are feeling much better. Do you think your issues are more genetic and just gradual damage over the years? Have you ever been injured during lifting?


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## ASHOP (May 22, 2020)

Good to hear your heading in the right direction. Stay tough my friend!


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## *Bio* (May 22, 2020)

Jim550 said:


> Just wanted to update that things have been getting better, I started physical therapy last week going 3 x week and am also doing stretches and exercises daily at home and walk around the neighborhood as well.  I see my doctor on Neurosurgeon on the 27th and will probably start going to the gym and start doing some machine workouts after that.  I started Mauvetop Hgh last week.  I am still taking some pain medicine but have definitely cut down on them which is good since taking them for over a year has caused addiction to them. Currently my supplements are:
> 
> 300mg Test Cyp/wk
> Mauvetop 3iu/day at night to help with sleep
> ...



That's great news!  It takes time but you're getting there!!


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## Concreteguy (May 22, 2020)

Good God, just reading the shit your going through is painful bro.
Hope nothing but the best for you friend.

  CG


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## Jim550 (Aug 1, 2020)

Concreteguy said:


> Good God, just reading the shit your going through is painful bro.
> Hope nothing but the best for you friend.
> 
> CG



Just now seeing this been off the board for a minute but thanks CG.  It's been pretty rough, my Neurosurgeon said I'm gonna probably have a ups and downs as far as the pain goes until I'm a year out or so from the surgery.  I'm still having some pain and some nerve pain mostly in the foot as far as nerve pain goes but I'll get ran*** nerve pain in the glutes and the legs as well.  I got a new pain management doctor which is great, he is really on top of his game.  Depending how the next few months go we might be looking into putting a Spine Stimulator in.


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## Jim550 (Sep 16, 2020)

Just wanted to give an update that I finally started back in the gym this week!  I'm glad to finally be back in there lifting weight.  I'm taking it easy and doing 12-15 reps and lot of machines.  Let me tell you I am sore!!! But it's a good muscle sore not a back pain sore, actually I haven't had any additional pain in the lower back and actually think I have less pain.  I am also working with a new physical therapist that is very sports related and actually used to be the PT and Strength coach for OU.   He really seems to know his shit compared to the last guy I went to.


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## javman (Sep 16, 2020)

Jim550,

Remember you well from back in the day on other forums. I remember PMing on a couple of things and I always appreciated the responses. 

I had no idea of your surgery and hope you are recovering well from it. Saw your post on the Syntek products and I don't think you'll be disappointed. I've used some of them with good results. Had a few buddies use the fat burning products with good results.


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## *Bio* (Sep 17, 2020)

That's great news!  Keep those muscles stretched and enjoy the road back!!


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## slide (Sep 18, 2020)

Jim550 said:


> Just wanted to give an update that I finally started back in the gym this week!  I'm glad to finally be back in there lifting weight.  I'm taking it easy and doing 12-15 reps and lot of machines.  Let me tell you I am sore!!! But it's a good muscle sore not a back pain sore, actually I haven't had any additional pain in the lower back and actually think I have less pain.  I am also working with a new physical therapist that is very sports related and actually used to be the PT and Strength coach for OU.   He really seems to know his shit compared to the last guy I went to.



That's great to hear; kind of a long road following this, but glad you're back lifting weights. 

-s


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## Jim550 (Sep 18, 2020)

Thanks fellas its been nice being back in the gym, definitely has cut down on my stress and just feel all around better.  Worked out every day this week so its going pretty good.  My hips were real sore from walking 2 miles on the treadmill (I had screws put in my iliac so that area is tight), but it only really lasted a day or so and am doing stretches for them.  Hopefully soon it wont be so damn hard to put on my socks and shoes.


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## Otis T Holbrook (Sep 21, 2020)

Go slow bro. More to life than the gym. (Being able to walk etc.)


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## muscle_4you (Sep 23, 2020)

Bless you brother for a speedy recovery!

NTR
MUSCLE_4YOU


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